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first aid for potential startus interruptus

Chadlebowski

Cruisin' Guzzisti
Joined
Jul 28, 2015
Messages
149
Location
West Sussex; UK
My 09 stelvio has would not always start 1st time every time, but always started after two or three attempts. I decided it was "personality" and got on with it.
Until this morning. Usual clock cycle, press starter button. click & nothing. I thought it was just showing it's personality again, but this time, it's (hopefully) terminal (pun intended).

Can I check that first steps are to clean all terminals and check fuses & relays? Replace the starter motor fuse? It seems fine on inspection.
The starter motor is pretty dusty\grimey - can I clean it in-situ or best to take out? do I clean with a toothbrush, baking soda and warm water?

Honestly don't know what a solenoid is... but I've learned my way around this bike so far. Let's say I'm a know-enough kinda mechanic who needs to add some more hours.

All responses gladly received!
 
First check battery voltage, if low, the starter won't activate. After that, check the grounds, even move the ground cable from behind the starter to a bell housing bolt. Clean battery terminals, resistance there can be an issue. As to cleaning the starter, it is the inside that needs to be cleaned, so disassembly required. Several thread here on cleaning up the solenoid action.
 
Thanks. Battery voltage (according to dash) was under 12V, so it's currently on charge.
I've removed the starter motor. The two long bolts are covered in white residue. Standard? More alarmingly, a pebble dropped out once the starter was out. Now how the heck would that have got in there?
The solenoid sits on top, right, and is a spring with a barrel? It's pretty clean in there, only a bit of grease - is that what I want to clean off? Otherwise, the action is pretty smooth when operated by hand.
I'll clean all terminals on reassembly, cross fingers and hit start. It was probably just a low battery, and I'll get on to the ignition re-wire.
 
Corrosion on the starter mounting bolts is not uncommon. While out a light coat of oil wouldn't hurt, but not coating them is OK too.

If the battery is a few years old, it may be time for replacement. Failure mode these days it it works right up until it doesn't leaving you stranded. You may have just received a warming.
 
Did you yet tried to spray some "contact cleaner for electronics" on the starter switch?
Many people on the italian forum solved in this way.
 
Think your barking up the wrong tree with taking things apart. As John suggested it sounds like your battery is on its way out. If it starts when you charge it back up then I would keep a close eye on it. Nothing mechanical, corroded or loose will cause the battery to drain. I would just replace it and call it a day.
 
Gotcha. If X is broke, don't go trying to fix Y...
Still, I now know how to service a starter motor, know where the solenoid is (and what it does, kind of), but more importantly, I've removed a stone that's been trapped in there for god-knows-how-long. Plus everything I uncovered has been lovingly cleaned and tenderly handled!
So +-two years for a glass mat motobatt is par for the course? TBH, my bike has been out only about once a week, and not for any substantial distances. I'm taking it to Scotland next week. Doubt I'll have a new battery by then. I'll be sure to be at the top of a hill before killing the power.
 
2 years seems to be average. Some may live longer with monthly trickle charging for 24 hours or so.
 
It isn't the battery, or rather the battery isn't charging - on-screen voltage read out kept dropping, before the engine cut-out about 90min and 60 miles in (to a 65mi journey).
Is it likely to be the alternator, or did I perhaps add a bad connection in taking off the starter motor?
And is it right that two earth cables terminate at the same point (the top bolt of the starter motor cover)?
Any suggestions of where to look greatly appreciated!
Ps the headlights don't work when the engine is running (except full beams) and the rear brake doesn't light up the brake light, but front brake does.
 
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You have either blown a fuse 2 your lighting relay (30 amp)or the lighting relay is not firing. That supplies power to your lights and the exciter circuit on the alternator. Start with those two. If those look ok look at the terminal on the alternator itself. Have come across a couple where the terminal is corroded. Pull back the boot on it and make sure it is clean and tight. That will also have the same symptoms. Common things on the 2012+ models but can also happen on the earlier ones.

If it was a ground issue the bike would not run at all or sporadically let alone start.
 
Chadlebowski,
I recently had an issue with my Breva 1100 - intermittent charging, intermittent headlight, some starting issues. Eventually the 30amp fuse blew. Problems disappeared with a new fuse. It seems likely that the 30amp fuse had a hairline crack. A chap with a Sport 1200 had similar issues and it turned out to be a dirty 30amp fuse holder.
 
Might have to take this one to the dealer.
Switched light relay fuse. It's a 15amp on the 08 Stelvio. And the 30A under the seat.
Will replace relay. Otherwise I'm stumped.
 
Might have to take this one to the dealer.
Switched light relay fuse. It's a 15amp on the 08 Stelvio. And the 30A under the seat.
Will replace relay. Otherwise I'm stumped.
Had to familiarize my self with the pre 2012 wiring diagram. Looks like the lighting relay main power is fed by a 20 amp fuse. Looks like there are 2 20 amp fuses next to eachother. You are correct about the 15 amp, that feeds the trigger side of the relay. The 20 amp feeds the power side.

If you have access to a multimeter, you want to check the voltage to ground at the white/green wire at the lighting relay when the bike is running, Should be terminal 30. It should have 12V when then key is on and 13.5+/- when the bike is running. If there is no power then you know it is the fuse. Start by checking that 20 amp fuse, if it is good then most likely the relay. If that is good, then it will be the connection at the alternator. Only possible senarios short of a broken wire in between. That relay and power to and from it is the only thing that controls both the head light and charging.
 
Just had the bike diagnosed with a faulty alternator. The earth wasn't making proper connection, and as a result the alternator burnt out from over-strain. Pricey fix, but good to know what the problem is!
 
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I found the charging problem on my "earlier" Norge was the main output cable from the alternator to battery positive, too many poor connections and fuse connections in there. Replaced the cable with a heavier one and got 14.3v at the battery immediately.
On the Stelvio there is a potential problem with the crimped connector on the back of the alternator.
 
I didn't think there was a ground on the alternator. It uses the chassis when it is bolted on. No??

I am always a little suspect when a dealer says it is an alternator. Rarely, if ever, does one fail but I guess it is possible. If there is a failure it is usually the voltage regulator which can be purchased for about $30. Just not sure I buy the grounding story from them. Grounding out I can see if the windings were damaged, but a loose ground not likely as the entire alternator would be flopping around. If it was a main chassis ground it would have affect more sensitive things first, like the ECU.

Of course, I am a Trust...and then Verify kind of guy so I don't believe much unless it make 100% sense, or I see it with my own eyes. :wasntme:
 
Thanks John - looks like a useful mod but I'm probably not going to fiddle unless there's a problem!
Canuck - it seemed a bit odd to me as well... I was pretty much at the mercy of the garage and just went on faith. They have returned the faulty alternator. Whether that's mine or something they had lying around I'll never know, but at least i can try test\refurb\sell the one they've returned.
Out of interest, how easy is it to visually inspect the new alternator, at least I can check if the new one has gone in, and isn't sitting in their stock-room?
 
Not 100% on the pre 2012. On mine you can catch a glimpse of it from the side of the bike. You can also remove the front belt access panel. From there you can see the front of the alternator and the pulley/belt but will require removal of the oil cooler (or at least loosing of it). May be enough to tell how new it is. Removal of the tank is your best bet however and may be the easiest.

I am sure they did replace the alternator. Only time will tell if it fixed the issue. If it was the VR a new one would have come with the new alternator so you are covered there. All comes down to cost.
 
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