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Norge Starts and Quits

Discussion in 'BNS12 Chat & Tech' started by Nick Greear, Jun 12, 2018.

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  1. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    After decades with BMW's, I bought a 2007 Norge last summer. Love it. But this morning an intermittent electrical problem cropped up. I rode it into town, then when I tried to start it to come home, the engine would start but immediately quit. After several attempts it started and I got home, but the same symptom is occurring now. New battery, starter spins it fine, and it runs perfect otherwise. Maintained for it's 65k miles perfectly. I'm six hours from a dealer, and not the best electrical guy, so any help would be appreciated.
    Nick
     
  2. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT Famiglia

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  3. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    John: Yes, I just did that and I have the original diagnostic code. After 1/2 hour of figuring out how to access the menu I found no ECU code errors, but three dashboard code errors: (DSB 05 M (fuel sensor), DSB 07 M Oil sensor, and DSB 08 Oil pressure). Reading the service manual I decided to delete those codes and start over. I deleted them and the engine started up. I don't know if this is a temporary fix or not so I'll keep checking it.
    Being a senior+ citizen guy, I'm having more trouble trying to figure out what "forum" we are in with this thread. I only found it because I had a keyword. Is there a help button for this forum? Thank you.
     
  4. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    Well it did not cure the problem John. There are now no error codes yet the problem persists, intermittently.
     
  5. kiwi dave

    kiwi dave GT Reference

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    Are you experiencing tank suck by any chance?
     
  6. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    1. A wrench appeared on the dashboard. Neither the Owners Manual or the service Manual say anything about it (that I can find).
    2. No error codes at present.
    3. Used to be you didn't have to hold the starter button down to start the engine, just push it and walk away. Now you have to hold it down until the engine starts.
    4. I went into the Menu and "Reset Maintenance." I have no idea what or how to set a maintenance.
    5. Now the starter button acts like it used to. The engine starts (for now).
    6. "Tank Suck." That's a new one for me Dave! Does that mean a tank venting problem? I'll go open the gas tank.

    Thank you all for responding. Nick
     
  7. kiwi dave

    kiwi dave GT Reference

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    If the tank is not ventilated, then a vacuum could form eventually discouraging any further flow of the fuel out of the tank. It was a long shot.

    But your starter should continue, and now it does. There is a relay that holds the start action while triggered. Might be a good idea to clean the pins of this relay. Really reaching for straws (again).
     
  8. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT Famiglia

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    If the wrench appears it means you are due for scheduled maintenance. Can include engine oil and filter change, valve adjustment, TB sync and TPS reset. There is a service schedule in the owners manual if you have one. If not they are available in the Downloads section. Once these are done the service interval is reset using the maintenance code through the dash menu.
     
  9. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    Actually, I don't think venting matters with fuel injection does it? A pressure pump inside the tank......
     
  10. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    TB=throttle body; TPS?
     
  11. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT Famiglia

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  12. Bisbonian

    Bisbonian Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    Yes, your tank can build up pressure and cause starting problems.
    While I would find it strange that this could be a new phenomenon with a bike with this number of miles, I guess it could happen.
    With my 1200 Sport, I noticed fairly soon after getting the bike. On a hot day the bike would crank but not start unless I gave it some throttle. I popped open the tank and would get a whoosh as pressure was released.
    I ended up removing the charcoal canister and have never had a problem since.
    My friend has a '15 V7. A couple of years after purchase he started having some weird starting issues and the bike would not run right. The first time he reloaded his map and all seemed well. The second time I suggested it might have something to do with his canister, he removed the canister and now the bike starts and runs normally all the time.
     
  13. Kubbie

    Kubbie Just got it firing!

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    Actually, I don't think venting matters with fuel injection does it? A pressure pump inside the tank......

    There was a problem with some Triumph Sprints. Tank vent would get blocked and vacuum actually collapsed several tanks. The plastic tanks would spring back, but the steel tanks looked like a crushed beer can.
     
  14. Nick Greear

    Nick Greear Just got it firing!

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    Ha!
    The bike starts normally now, but I didn't do anything to fix it. I tried to install a new starter relay but gave up trying to access it. Oh well.
     
  15. tris

    tris Just got it firing!

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    I'm (hopefully) at the end of a long mission trying to sort my B11 out and one of the problems was that you had to crank for ages and catch it on the throttle to get it to start

    Fitted a new cam sensor the other day and it seems to be resolved

    Last night I pushed the start button and hands off it started right up, but I need some miles under my belt to be sure

    See here guzziriders.org/breva-1100-low-idle-speed_topic8930.html
     

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