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V65 - Strange timing issue

Dr. Jake

Dr. Jake

Just got it firing!
Joined
Jul 18, 2018
Messages
23
Location
Copenhagen, Denmark
Hey all. Looking for input. I decided to look in to the timing of my V65C in an efford to cure a tendency to run a bit too hot. I found the timing to be way advanced. I set it to factory specs +7 degrees (measured both stativ and with timing gun) and found it was nearly impossible to start and ran like cr.p. After messing around a bit i set it back to where it was (which also roughly corresponde with the factory mark on the timing plate). It now starts and runs fine with 22degrees of static advance??

I don’t get it.

There is no markings on the flywheel but I am absolutely confident that TDC is correctly identified using a piston stop. I run stock setup with points. The mechanic advance mechanism is working properly.

Whats going on?

Jake
 
Some flywheels then had no marks but there should have been a square punch mark at 7 and a round one at 10 for V35/50 motors. When you drop advance down to 7 motor will run slower and richer, to keep same rpm have to raise speed screw and adjust idle mixture to compensate. I used to install non epa mixture screws. For USA emissions they had a long narrow tip. I have not experienced the problem you have, make sure valve rockers are adjusted correctly ahead of time. Could be the point gap closed up while adjusting timing also, nature of the beast.
 
V700Steve said:
Some flywheels then had no marks but there should have been a square punch mark at 7 and a round one at 10 for V35/50 motors. When you drop advance down to 7 motor will run slower and richer, to keep same rpm have to raise speed screw and adjust idle mixture to compensate. I used to install non epa mixture screws. For USA emissions they had a long narrow tip. I have not experienced the problem you have, make sure valve rockers are adjusted correctly ahead of time. Could be the point gap closed up while adjusting timing also, nature of the beast.
Click to expand...

I could under no circumstances make it run even near properly at 7 degrees as per the workshop manual - points gap dead on and lots of idle screw messing about. Now it starts and runs excellent at 22 degrees advance. Just seems strange

Oh well. It runs

Jake
 
V700Steve said:
Some flywheels then had no marks but there should have been a square punch mark at 7 and a round one at 10 for V35/50 motors. When you drop advance down to 7 motor will run slower and richer, to keep same rpm have to raise speed screw and adjust idle mixture to compensate. I used to install non epa mixture screws. For USA emissions they had a long narrow tip. I have not experienced the problem you have, make sure valve rockers are adjusted correctly ahead of time. Could be the point gap closed up while adjusting timing also, nature of the beast.
Click to expand...

I think you may have answered my question. I have a V50 II running very poorly (knocking severely) and it appears to be a timing issue. I've tried boosting octane up to 100 over "clean" 93 pump gas (per the service manual specs) and that made little to no difference. I am now confirming the timing on this electronic ignition model and noticed neither of the 2 marks on the flywheel correspond to TDC for piston #1. Good to know I'm not crazy, at least not in this case. This bike has 32k on it but sat for 10-15 years before I got it--fuel petcocks turned off, thankfully. The manual notes there is a special tool to assist with aligning electronic pick-ups...I guess the factory didn't need a mark for TDC.
 
Something I run into is some so called mechanic swapped out the clutch or rear main seal and put flywheel on wrong. The Bosch system as you have is pretty good but I have changed out failures on the sensor & black boxes.
 
V700Steve said:
Something I run into is some so called mechanic swapped out the clutch or rear main seal and put flywheel on wrong. The Bosch system as you have is pretty good but I have changed out failures on the sensor & black boxes.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip Steve. I was wondering if something like that was even possible. With 32k miles it may or may not have had major work done in the past. I see no evidence of a major overhaul. I think a bad starter did it in way back when...then it just sat.

Strangely, one of the Bosch pick-ups does not adjust within tolerance (without some filing :-| ). They were actually in contact with the crank which wore a 2mm grove into them. Surprising it ran at all. Might be evidence of some prior wrenching.

My plan is to mark TDC on the flywheel, then readjust the pick-ups once I get the 1st cylinder pick-up mounting bracket adjusting within spec again. Hope to be on the road after that if all goes well!
 
Just the tip for you, as flywheel has 90 teeth, every tooth is 4 deg, easy to use screwdriver in inspection hole to move crankshaft by given angle.
 
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