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Is there a "fixed" central position on headstock or are my bearings shot?

R

ramli

Just got it firing!
Joined
Aug 12, 2012
Messages
8
Location
Viljandi
Hello all,

having hitten a ground last weekend and misaligned my Stelvios steering (slight nonperpendicularity between front wheel and handlebar) in the woods I am looking for to correct it today. I so hope that forks are not bended but are turned in yokes. Actually i cant imagine those massive forks would be bent on a such slam.

Anyway, question is from another opera - may be just something that I have not noticed before, but is there some intended exaggerated central positioning in steering head?

I mean, putting her on a central stand and supporting so that front wheel is off the ground, playing easy around the "straight line" on handlebars, is it supposed to have slight "return to straight direction position" here. In my case it is subtle, but clearly existent. It is as subtle to not interfere actual steering but firmly here as to return and even to give some pendulum effect to the handlebars, if moved out from center about just some degrees and left free.


Otherwise it turns all smooth and silent from end to end. Also no play in headstock that I could feel. Thus it does not sound for me as a headstock bearings have gone bad. Jet I wonder how did not I noticed it before.

BTW, its a 2012 NTX I talk about.

Ilmar
 
Sounds like you need steering head bearings. It should be smooth with no different feeling at any point. What you describe is typical worn bearings. You don't say your mileage but they do wear as you describe.
 
Thanks Rudy, kind of answer I was afraid I'll get.
I have 37k km's on it (or about 23k miles). Aint it too little for that? Have not regreased it myself though, so may be pretty normal considering the factorys lack of grease supply .
 
Are you just saying that if you hang it free, it tends to swing back?
If so, that is easily just the cables and gravity swinging it back.

Bearing damage is almost always worse when you load the bearing, that is, put normal weight on the front. And it is usually a single 'notched' spot.
The tapered bearing in the head would take a pretty hard hit to be damaged. Most often they are replaced due to rust.
 
His comment of a centralized spot makes me think bearings. If you can feel any notch the bearings are probably bad if you have eliminated something hanging up in the wiring or cable. And those hanging up normally do not feel like a notch.
I don't think the fall did it. I think the km's and time with Guzzi's notoriously short grease application. Of course Guzzi is not the only manufacturer to do that. They all seem to put the minimum amount of grease for optimum conditions where I guess the bike is only ridden in climate controlled rooms and never sees water.
 
Yes Wayne, it swings back but only from very near from center. I tend do believe in bad bearings. It feels like too pronounced for the cramped cables.
Well, made short video.

Dont really think it is related to my crash, probably just coincident timing. Propably should have greased the headstock same time i did my rear shock linkage and swingarm bearings.
 
Yes, I think you are all correct. Already dismantling it, just have to go and get that 14 mm hex key though. Everything else off, moving the bare yoke I have no doubt anymore.

Sad thing is, some extra damage is discovered under the "hood". Right fairing is no big deal, but cracked headlamp assembly may turn costly, if not repairable.
 
Sorry to hear about your problems ramli, on the subject of the headstock is there a specified torque?
Everytime I replace headstock bearings I first leave them sloppy and then trash them by overtightening.
As everything else has needed looking at now I've past 30k miles I spose I should regrease the headstock having done the swingarm.
 
Ray, as per shop manual, first nut is at 40Nm /29,5lbxxx and counterlock nut is at manual+90 degrees. Yokes fixing cap is at 100Nm/73,86lbxxx

As a conclusion, yes mu bearings were shot, especially the lower one. Jet, they had surprisingly plenty of grease. Lower one has seen some water and had rust damage + spots, upper bearing was clean of rust but there are visible contact spots. New ones will be roller type, will get them tomorrow.

Ilmar
 
I found hand tight plus 90 degrees on the lock nut moved the preload nut also so watch out for that when you tighten.
Alan NZ
 
On my Hondas I use a method I was told by the Honda service rep and it was in the service manual for my 1987 VFR700. I have used it on many bikes since but not sure if it would work on a Guzzi.
With the forks pointing straight ahead and the wheel off the ground I take a fish scale and hook it up to the fork tube at the upper triple clamp with the wheel and handlebars in place, cables on but not binding. I I then pull straight back and straight forward looking for 3 to 3.5 pounds before the wheel starts to turn. I have heard of wing riders using a higher number but this is what was recommended by the rep for Gold Wings and the VFR back in the late 1980's.
Not sure how this method would work on a Guzzi but I used it on tapered and ball bearings on the aforementioned bikes plus several PC800's. When I put the roller bearings in my VFR the torque method would not work as when I tightened the lock nut to the recommended torque the bearings would tighten up and NO, the adjusting nut did not turn. I even had a friend hold the wrench on it so it did not turn. Made no sense to me but I did it several times with the same results. Not being insane, well, not totally, I used the fish scale method and it worked fine.
 
I had a chanche to assemble my bike yesterday, finally. Today I am glad to report it runs straight and well again.

Jet, roller bearings didnt get along well with dust seals, so had to order original ball type ones as well. No problem, as I was able to return the first ones. Considering that original set worked fine four years, well lubed new set should get even longer. So supposedly longer lasting roller type bearing was not that mandatory for me. Makes me wonder though, as there are some MG specialized web shop which sells roller bearing as an upgraded type for the case, how do they expect them to be installed?

As an side effect to the affair I can say that the type of the plastic they used to mold the headlamp assembly had good weldability. So all the cracks were quite easily repairable at home. Big plus.
Another plus for me is that in this situation I am pretty sure my ugly double-foldable rear brake lever prototype had to work hard. And it did well, so it is time for a more elegant final version on that :cool:.

Last issue from the event - repair attempt on my right side case is somewhere in the nearest future, not jet sure it is doable.
 
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