Cold Blooded?

[pokeyjoe]

I've only had my V7 for a couple weeks, but I commute on it daily. I haven't had an air-cooled bike for a bit and never a fuel injected one. When I start off in the morning, it tends to bog down at low RPM for the first block or so. After that it's fine. When I leave work in the afternoon, I don't have any trouble at all. Do I just need to let it warm up some more in the morning?

 

[john zibell]

The small blocks don't have a stepper motor system. They do tend to be a little cold blooded. Just run easy the first few blocks and she should be fine, perhaps have the high idle engaged for awhile. It is better to warm them up rolling than sitting at idle.

 

[pokeyjoe]

I tried the fast idle this morning and it helped. I'll just have to experiment to figure out how much I should use.

 

[goog64]

I will soon be wiring a 5000 Ohm variable resistor in series with my engine temp sensor to fix this cold running problem.
I did it temporarily about a month ago and it works beautifully.
(It tricks the ECU into thinking that the engine is colder, so it supplies more fuel - what a difference! After a few blocks, I will just switch the resistor out of the circuit.)

 

[mgv7racer]

Just follow the directions in the owners manual. Fast idle on full, half throttle, and it starts right away. Drive off with fast idle on. Turn off in 3 - 5 mins.

 

[goog64]

Riding off that quickly only works for fewer than 50% of the V7s of which I am aware.
And the fast idle is only doing something up until a very small opening of the throttle. Beyond that point its cam is disengaged from its contact point.

 

[sign216]

Just follow the directions in the owners manual. Fast idle on full, half throttle, and it starts right away. Drive off with fast idle on. Turn off in 3 - 5 mins.

I find it starts better with just 1 second of half throttle, and then rolling it back to no throttle.

Alternatively, cranking for a second at half throttle. And then cranking again with no throttle.

Fires up well.

 

[Paxo]

Suspect you all maybe over thinking this. You're not exactly trying to fire up a 747. I've never had any problem getting the bike to start, just pull in the clutch and press the button, pull the cold start lever back, put on gloves and helmet, push the lever back and ride off. Simple, but then I have been riding bikes for quite a long time.

 

[pokeyjoe]

I don't use the fast idle. Its still fairly warm here in the morning (60F/16C). I'm sure when it starts cooling off I will use it. For now, I open the throttle a bit and it fires right up. Idle is a tad slower (1K RPM) for a minute or two. The fast idle is just a bandaid for not being able to enrich the mixture when its cold. I'll use it when the bike idles very slow and needs some help in the morning. It doesn't do much until the very end of the lever travel anyway. Is that just the cam or can it be adjusted?

 

[wittangamo]

Starting isn't the issue, stalling is. Fast idle is a band-aid, but it does help even in warm weather to keep idle high enough that the bike doesn't stall out for the first couple of minutes or miles. I always used the approach suggested by Paxo and had no problems. If it was really cold, or if I was in too big a hurry for a 60-second warmup, I'd keep fast idle on for the first mile or two.

 

[sign216]

I don't use the fast idle. Its still fairly warm here in the morning (60F/16C). I'm sure when it starts cooling off I will use it. For now, I open the throttle a bit and it fires right up. Idle is a tad slower (1K RPM) for a minute or two. The fast idle is just a bandaid for not being able to enrich the mixture when its cold. I'll use it when the bike idles very slow and needs some help in the morning. It doesn't do much until the very end of the lever travel anyway. Is that just the cam or can it be adjusted?

Pokey, usually the lever cam does need to be adjusted, and a turn or two cut off the spring as well. It's too strong, but not cam enough "bite" on the wire.

The fast idle lever is there as a simple and economical substitute for an Idle Air Control Valve/Bypass Valve. Air flow is what controls the idle rpms. An idle air control valve could do it, at an added complication. The easy answer is the manual throttle stop. And I don't blame Guzzi for going the simple route. Here it makes sense.

 

[pokeyjoe]

Pokey, usually the lever cam does need to be adjusted, and a turn or two cut off the spring as well. It's too strong, but not cam enough "bite" on the wire.

Thanks for that. Maybe if I get it adjusted properly, I'll start using it.

The fast idle lever is there as a simple and economical substitute for an Idle Air Control Valve/Bypass Valve. Air flow is what controls the idle rpms. An idle air control valve could do it, at an added complication. The easy answer is the manual throttle stop. And I don't blame Guzzi for going the simple route. Here it makes sense.

Yes, of course. I'm just coming off a bike that was mindless for me (stepper motor). I need to get my brain adjusted.

 

[goog64]

I finally got my 5000 Ohm trimpot wired in series (switchable) with my engine temp sensor today. First cold "running" (please don't read that as "starting") test will be tomorrow. I'll let you know ....

 

[rbm]

It doesn't do much until the very end of the lever travel anyway. Is that just the cam or can it be adjusted?

My fast idle cam follower was the same as yours ... about 1mm distant from the actuator cam. I experienced the same problem as you ... fast idle was barely 1200RPM at full travel. Cold starting was an issue for me.

I fitted a metal sleave over the cam follower bearing and that solved my starting and "slow" fast idle issues. The reason I didn't adjust the distance was because I couldn't see an obvious means of making the adjustment. There might be a way to adjust the separation between the cam and its follower, however I was not able to discern how that was accomplished. If your bike is still under warranty, I would advise seeking dealer assistance rather than resort to my solution.

Picture of my modification:

 

[john zibell]

You could have just loosen the screw holding the cable,slid the adjuster up to move the cam closer, and re-tightened the screw. You don't want the cam hitting the linkage with the cable relaxed to ensure proper return to idle.

 

[pokeyjoe]

You could have just loosen the screw holding the cable,slid the adjuster up to move the cam closer, and re-tightened the screw.

I did this (and it works), but I like the sleeve solution as well. Now I need to find a sleeve. Thanks!

 

[goog64]

You could have just loosen the screw holding the cable,slid the adjuster up to move the cam closer, and re-tightened the screw. You don't want the cam hitting the linkage with the cable relaxed to ensure proper return to idle.

That's a different problem. If the cam goes through it's full travel, but still doesn't push the throttle enough, one needs to close the gap - for which the sleeve solution is excellent.

Meanwhile, I've tested my inline 5000 ohm trimpot - brilliant!!! For the first time ever, I could start the bike and ride off immediately without stalling or surging. It felt SO nice. Then a few blocks later I switched the trimpot out and rode on happily!
For a write up of what I did, with pictures, see Wildguzzi in the next couple of days.

 

[rbm]

John, Loosening the cable and adjusting the cam as you describe will bring the cam closer to the follower. That is a different adjustment as pointed out above as it has the effect of reducing the travel for the fast idle lever (the cam hits the stop sooner in it travel). However, this adjustment will not ultimately change the final opening at the TB when the fast idle lever reaches it full travel. There will be no change to the fast idle speed. I did experiment with this adjustment before landing upon the sleeve idea.

There does not seem to be an adjustment that brings the follower closer to the cam when at rest. It appears to be related to how the assembly is manufactured. There is a nut at the base of the TB's butterfly valve pivot that appears it could be loosened and the follower moved; I chose not to touch that fixture for fear of upsetting some factory-designed balance in the TB.

Pokey, the sleeve I used was originally a metal standoff, used in the electronics industry. It has an I.D. of 7mm and an O.D. of 9mm. This is a loose slip fit over the follower bearing. I use a tiny bit of adhesive to secure the sleeve in place. If you are having problems finding a sleeve, I have a piece left over I can mail you.