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1200S engine swap

Discussion in 'BNS12 Chat & Tech' started by KRHguzi, Nov 24, 2014.

  1. KRHguzi

    KRHguzi Tuned and Synch'ed

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    The engine failed on my 08 1200S due to a oil pump failure so I am faced with choice ofspending too much money having it rebuilt or swapping it for a running engine. Is it possible to install a 8V engine and transmission into a 4V chassis? Has anyone done performed that swap and what mods were required?
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2014
  2. GTM®

    GTM® Administrator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

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    In theory, it should be a simple swap, as the cases and transmission should be identical. I can't think of a single reason it wouldn't swap. YMMV.
     
  3. Oz1200Guzzi

    Oz1200Guzzi High Miler

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    I have it on record from the gurus, that this will work. The only difference is the exhaust/oil cooler location if the donor unit comes from a GRiSO. No big issues either way.
     
  4. KRHguzi

    KRHguzi Tuned and Synch'ed

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    Thanks for the input, now the search for suitable donor bike.
     
  5. ghezzi

    ghezzi High Miler GT Contributor

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    Damaged 1200S coming up for auction early Dec at Manheim in Brisbane.
    Headlight/ instruments/right side peg and levers gone. Right side tappet cover damage.
     
  6. KRHguzi

    KRHguzi Tuned and Synch'ed

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    SAM_2766.JPG SAM_2765.JPG I am using the engine and drive train from a wrecked 2013 Griso along with the engine mangement sytem. The quickest and easiest way to do that was to use the electrical sytem from the from the Griso. The connectors for the lighting and signals is different but that is a far simpler adaptation than the fuel injection and computer.
    A few photos of the progress so far.
    The Griso exhaust and oil cooler will be used along with the Griso insturment panel.
     
  7. KRHguzi

    KRHguzi Tuned and Synch'ed

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    It runs finally SAM_2769.JPG
     
  8. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

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    Nice work. Be sure to check front end travel. It is hard to tell from the picture above, but it looks like the RH pipe will be close to the fender when the forks compress.
     
  9. ghezzi

    ghezzi High Miler GT Contributor

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    I know they have different frames, but is the geometry that much different between the two? Otherwise, custom exhaust.
     
  10. JAS

    JAS Tuned and Synch'ed

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    Looks like you are making good progress, hope it goes well.

    I thought oil pump failures were supposed to be restricted to early 2v Norges? Am now starting to get nervous with my 07 Sport.....

    What actually happened? Did you get any warning signs?
     
  11. Android

    Android Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Famiglia

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    My 07 Sport oil pump failed , I was motoring when it happened ...needed new crank and conrods.....I managed to get a norge 1200 short engine as I had all sorts of messing around with MG not suppyling parts.
    Some pumps crack the outer rotor .....mine wore the drive flats off the inner rotor......one second it was working ...next second not :-(
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2015
  12. KRHguzi

    KRHguzi Tuned and Synch'ed

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    The exhaust is mounted too low at the muffler. On a Griso the muffler mount on the passenger pegs is apx a 1/1/2 " higher which will tilt the pipes out of the way at the front wheel. New pipe and muffler are on the way which will cure the wheel interference .

    The latest plan is to move the oil cooler and use the exhaust from the 1200 sport.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2015
  13. JAS

    JAS Tuned and Synch'ed

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    So what is the general consensus out there? Keep running the 2v 1200 Sport and wait for an issue or change the oil pump now? Is there an upgraded pump that does not suffer from the cracking problem?
     
  14. Android

    Android Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Famiglia

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    @JAS .....when I rebuilt mine I got a new pump of course but there was no difference between old and new that I could measure.
    My advice is check your pump ...you need special socket (deep socket with od turned down) for end of crank nut and a puller for the multi vee belt pulley.
    when refitting sprockets leave out the oil pump key (it is tiny and easy to lose) until the others are fitted then rotate oil pump spindle to aline drive keyways.

    Don't wait for it to really spoil your day
    PM me if you want the back ground story ...don't want to hijack the thread
     
  15. Brian UK

    Brian UK GT Reference

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    Oh, there was a difference, the faulty one was round where the shaft went into the rotor. :D

    JAS, the only way to check is to pull the pump and look for yourself. On the my Norge the outer rotor was in 4 pieces. On Android's the inner rotor was freewheeling on the shaft. Don't know what the fault on the OPs pump was.

    In my case, the replacement pump had a very tight fit between the shaft and inner rotor, the old one was quite loose.
     
  16. JAS

    JAS Tuned and Synch'ed

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    Android / Brian, thanks for the feedback. 300 Euro / 6-8 week wait for the pump, having to remove the pulleys and timing chain to replace it, not looking forward to that job! I'll PM you Android for the low down.
     
  17. Brian UK

    Brian UK GT Reference

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    €300 sounds right, it cost over £200 in the UK a few years back. But I got mine supplied from Italy within the week. Ordered by the dealer Monday, had it in my hand Friday.
     
  18. 2Laner

    2Laner Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    This thread is not making me feel good. Excuse me for sounding dumb here but should I now worry about an oil pump failure with no warning? No Warning! I love my 08 Sport 2 valve and had hoped to run it well into my Golden Senior Years. Well maybe not Golden, at least until I start falling down a lot. Seriously, is this cause for concern? What can I do to prevent a failure? About 43,000 miles on mine so far. Regular maintenance stuff, nothing major. Guzzi Guru's make me feel the love.
     
  19. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

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    It is like this. The oil pump is a mechanical part. Mechanical parts can fail. Can the failure of the oil pump be predicted, probably not. You have 43 K on your bike now. If it were to fail because of a manufacturing defect, it would probably have failed by now. I'd say ride it and inspect the pump when it is time to replace the timing chain. Probably at around 90 to 100K miles or so.
     
  20. Brian UK

    Brian UK GT Reference

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    I would say as John, don't worry about it, but equally never ignore the oil pressure warning light if it comes on when the engine is running. It might be a faulty switch, but it might not.
     

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