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Ambo with no spark

Bruno55

Bruno55

Tuned and Synch'ed
Joined
Apr 21, 2009
Messages
54
Location
Near Auzances, Limousin
I have been trying to get my Ambassador running after a long lay up.Moving to a new country (England to France) and rebuilding an old French farmhouse has meant the bike has been sitting around a while so I have changed all the oils and seen to other minor repairs the bike needed.The bike turns over OK but has no spark to either plug.I have checked out the main battery earth and all the obvious connections but cannot find anything wrong.I have always hated electrics on bikes and find them hard work unlike mechanical parts.
The bike is pretty much standard and was wondering what was the best order to check out possible causes of the problem.
 
Farmhouse restoration sounds like a real challenge!

As far as spark, Do you have a voltmeter?

Set it to DC, turn on the ignition, put the black to the ground on the battery or a KNOWN GOOD frame ground. Set the Volt Meter to DC. Put the red lead of the Volt Meter on one terminal of the coil. If no 12V, then try the other terminal on the coil. If there is no 12V, turn the engine a bit (by the flywheel). Still no 12 V? That's one type of problem.

If there is 12V at the coil, then there may be a distributor related issue.
Replace the condenser (capacitor), check (replace) the points. Adjust the points and put your red lead of the voltage meter to the wire on the points. Be carefull not to gound the lead you are using to check the Voltage at the points (you will know when you do). Do you get 12V at the points when the points are open? If no that's another type of problem.

If all this is OK,and still no sparkie at either plug, check the rotor and cap (danger high voltage will excite yer pacemaker). Pull both plugs, connect each to plug wire/caps, ground the plugs by laying them on the cylinders in a way that you can see the plug gap, crank the engine... no twisty on the throttle here. Any sparkies? if no that is another typr of problem.

Please perform the above and report back in the morning.

A farmhouse in France eh? Sounds great!

Alex
 
Hi Alex
Yes,the farmhouse is fun,but hard work.I have just made 42 big oak beams as a previous owner had removed a whole floor!
I have a meter.The points are nearly new as is the condenser.I realise condensers can go bad but will they stop a spark? I thought that if the condenser went I would see a big spark at the points as the condenser was there to reduce damage to the points face.Getting a new condenser will be a problem as I am in the middle of nowhere and spares hard to get.And my French is not that good yet.
I will do the other checks and get back to you.Then I have to build an oak staircase to get to the floor I have just put in!Thanks for your help.
 
Me again,I have just noticed where you are.My Bike was sold from new by Schleicher motors in Oakland!
I visited San Jose years ago for a Custom Chrome dealer convention.Small world.
 
Hi Alex
I have just performed all the checks you suggested and had 12V all the way.Still no spark at the plugs.
The rotor and cap look good,no cracks ( I can see ) and I cleaned all the relevant bits.
 
Bruno55 said:
Hi Alex
I have just performed all the checks you suggested and had 12V all the way.Still no spark at the plugs.
The rotor and cap look good,no cracks ( I can see ) and I cleaned all the relevant bits.
Click to expand...

Can you get a spark from the coil when you manually open the points? If not, you may have a failed coil. Also if the points do not open when the engine turns over, you will have no spark.
 
Are we talking about the bike in your avatar or a different one? If it has a tachometer, disconnect the leads to the tach. Sometimes when the tach fails, it grounds out and kills the spark.
 
It is the one in my avatar,so does not have a tacho.
I have opened and closed the points manually and got a spark at the coil lead.I then re-assembled the distributor and got a spark at the plugs.
Tried to start the bike and it ran for about 2 seconds (only after squirting some easy start down the carbs).It does not seem keen.It used to be a very good starter before the lay-up.
 
Sounds like we are getn' somewhere.
Sparked a bit, ran a bit, then zip eh? Both plugs sparked eh?
Try the open close point thing again with the plugs out. (NGK BP7ES?) Make sure the plugs are clean and gapped OK. Did the plugs foul during the running attempt?
If sparks, try installing plugs again and re run. If no ... maybe bad wire from cap to coil.. I've had cap to coil wire have intermitt connection on either end... makes electricity creep along hidden cracks.

If both plugs are acting badly, then the prob is probably something that is common to both... Points, condenser, cap, rotor, cap to coil wire. Make sure the points are clean (free of olive oil, fermier, etc.). My G5, stored for decades, had points that looked great... very intermit... The condenser can act up but usually the wiring to it is my problem. Cap and wiring can be very sneaky... if in doubt, hold the top of the distributor with your bare hand, have someone crank the engine with the ign on... you will KNOW if there are electrons loose... shocking experience indeed.

Have you ridden Rue Napolean?

Alex
 
I have just been wondering about the spark plugs.I know old ignition systems will not produce a fat spark like a modern system,but would some g-power or iridium NGK plugs help? The spark on my V7 is not brilliant.
 
Bruno55 said:
I have just been wondering about the spark plugs.I know old ignition systems will not produce a fat spark like a modern system,but would some g-power or iridium NGK plugs help? The spark on my V7 is not brilliant.
Click to expand...

Probably wouldn't hurt, but may not help. For now, just stick with standard plugs, but gap on the close side, about 0.25 inch. The old coils don't give much spark and the wider the gap, the more voltage required to make the jump. If you still have the original type spark plug caps, replace them with NGK right angle caps. I like to use the LB05F caps.
 
I have the NGK caps already.The coil is not the original,it was changed some years back.I think the coil on it now was listed for a VW beetle.
Is there a better coil to use?
 
Bruno55 said:
I have the NGK caps already.The coil is not the original,it was changed some years back.I think the coil on it now was listed for a VW beetle.
Is there a better coil to use?
Click to expand...

The VW coil is a good substitute, however, there is no guarantee it hasn't gone weak. Coils tend to fail when hot. Since the bike did start then die, it is suspect.
 
Bruno55 said:
I have the NGK caps already.The coil is not the original,it was changed some years back.I think the coil on it now was listed for a VW beetle.
Is there a better coil to use?
Click to expand...

The best coil IMO is the Bosch Blue Coil, meant as a performance coil for VW Beetles. Been using the same one for the last 15 years with good success. Since it's epoxy filled (vs. oil filled like some cheaper ones) it's much more durable. Less than $30 here in the 'States.

The original plug gap spec. was .023" and that's what I gap NGK BP6ES plugs at.
 
Read your Post Charlie (many thanks) so I thought I will look into getting a blue coil.I have someone coming over from the UK to France soon who is a car mechanic who can source parts.
I have just looked on the net and found that blue coils can be a minefield.
With or without resistor
Made in Brazil,Mexico,Spain or at one time Germany!
Is there a part number for a blue coil I should be looking for?
 
Looking at the coil fitted at the moment,it is an after-market car coil.(not a make that would be recognised in the US)
I cannot find out the spec. of this coil,as it seems the manufacturer went pop in 2002.
I see I need a coil of 3 ohm resistance.If the coil fitted is not 3 ohm,would it work but give a bad spark?
 
It seemed difficult to pin down the correct Bosch blue coil so I have ordered a Pertronix Flame Thrower to perk the old girl up!
I will not have it for a couple of weeks so will post to say how it works in a while.
 
Had the family over today from the UK with the new flame thrower coil. After fitting the bike started and ran really well.Now if I can just free up the clutch................................... :roll:
 
Clutch now free.No need for complete clutch rebuild,what is needed is a big French granite barn.Wheel against the barn,clutch dropped with engine running,et voila! clutch fixed!
 
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