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pete roper said:
Just call me 'Mr. Stupid'

Pete
Click to expand...

I'll refrain.

Once again, your "response" bears no relation to what I posted. I am interested in gathering evidence and establishing facts. That's what an NHTSA report is designed to accomplish. It is not a "witch hunt," as you so quaintly describe it. We have been down this road before regarding what the NHTSA does and what a report involves. Why do you continue to rail against something that you know nothing about?

You continue to state that you have yet to see a secondary failure of the A8 or recalled A5 engines. Just because you have not seen something with your own eyes, does not mean that it didn't happen.

Every time one such failure is pointed out to you, you have the same response: "We don't know what oil was used... we don't know if the cam was shimmed correctly... we don't know what else might have caused this... well, it hasn't happened to any of MY customers.... " Kurt's bike had the recall done before delivery, and the valvetrain with the improved parts failed at three years and 26,000 miles. I am willing to bet that during that time Kurt used the proper oil, maintained his bike correctly, and that the first recall was done properly. If that's the case, then what is your excuse for this failure? By my reckoning, you are out of excuses.

Ironically, I agree with you; we need more facts. Now, why would you be against having an outside agency gather those facts? There can only be one of two reasons: paranoia or fear. IMO, neither is a very good reason.
 
If you'd like an example of something to REALLY get shitty about? Try this.

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This has been knocked back for warranty because the factory is claiming that the V7 'Racer' is a 'special' machine and, it seems, you aren't actually supposed to ride it. Just look at it! his bike is owned by someone who works at the Canberra dealer. They still won't honour the warranty! To say I'm appaled is an understatement. I'm trying to submit another claim on his behalf, (The first one was done by the 'Dealer' in question who have just lost the franchise so it was probably done in a very lacklustre fashion.) but I dunno what luck I'll have.

After that it'll be lawyers, or it would be if it was my overpriced POS that it had happened to!

Pete
 
Much ado about nothing going on here, Kurt has decided to sell his Stelvio because of something he has seen and hears occasionally, not a Failure or break down in my perspective, As far as the NHTSA getting involved why ? I don't recall any 8 valve motors here or over the Pond where the biggest majority of failures has occurred come to a screeching halt, rear tire locked up flinging the rider off and causing bodily harm, when they fail they go horribly loud. Why were the majority of failures occurring across the pond ? Simple, they got the 8 Valve motor a year or 2 before the US market, The valve train problems were addressed and for the most part corrected before they arrived in the US, Not to say that a few lemons did not arrive with the old parts. A question for Kurt, when they replaced the initial valve components were they shimmed and correctly ? We probably will never learn. I think I will go out now and flog the shit out of my 8V Griso to clear my head.
 
youcanrunnaked said:
That's what an NHTSA report is designed to accomplish.
Click to expand...

The NHTSA will not get involved and they could care less.
Argue if you wish. Been there, done that.

Remember back to the 2003-04 hydraulic lifter bike. There were a lot of REAL documented multiple failures. The NHTSA didn't care that your engine would eat a cam follower over a 200 mile ride and make a racket as the hard bits made there way through the motor chewing it up.

My understanding on that, in the US, was that about 8% of the hydraulic lifter motors were failing. If you were in that unlucky group, new parts would NOT correct your bike. It turned out that a supplier had over done the valve springs and the extra spring pressure was the issue. So replacing the cams and lifters simple resulted in a repeat failure until the springs were replaced.

Besides, there are NO confirmation that this is even a repeat failure. One person had one cam failure, now it made a concerning noise. Even if it did fall under the eye of the NHTSA, and it does not, they would ignore it at this point.

I'll admit, if mine had an issue, I would be finding out more about valve spring measurements.
 
Wayne Orwig said:
The NHTSA will not get involved and they could care less.
Click to expand...

Let me go out on a limb here and make an educated guess based on how things are back here ...

That's actually there basic reason of existence?


:arrow:


From what I understand, Guzzi never excelled at after-sales service, except through a handful of dedicated dealers worth their weight in gold. Piaggio OTOH have a considerable history of dealers leaving, fed up with a brand that appears to consider its products as throwaways with an EOL roughly coinciding with the end of the warranty period. (And I'm sure they'd be giving only 6 months of warranty if they could...)
 
Wayne Orwig said:
Were the valve clearances changing with the new parts in there?
Click to expand...

Yes! Only on the right side, not the left. The left hand side was the one that went south the 1st time.

For those who asked, The oil was changed per Guzzi specs. with 10W-60 Agip. After the cam & tappets were changed I took Pete's advise and changed the oil every 3k rather than the 6K that Guzzi spec'ed.

I beleive it is a lubrication issue, I say that only going by the noise of the engine, no hard facts with a pressure gauge. The motor would sound healthy at a idle when hot, then all of a sudden I would hear a slap - slap for 3 to 7 seconds coming from the right side head, then it would go back to the normorl sound of ticky - ticky.

If I understand the dynamics of the 8v motor, the tappets should turn in the head while running for even wear, I beleive the slap - slap is the sound the tappet / cam was making when it is not turning because of lack of lubrication. I could be way off base, but that is my theroy.

I have my new GS, only ridden it 200 miles because of the rain we have been having here on the east coast of the USA. What I like...........the fuel injection, it's very smooth, the suppension, far superior to the Guzzi, what I miss........the torque of the Guzzi motor, it pulls like a old John Deere B tractor and for riding in the mountain roads in VA & WV that will be greatly missed, the BMW is a pig because it weighs so much.

I have heard of two 8v motors going south on the second set of cams & tappets, they were both in Europe. So there aren't a whole lot of issues.

That being said I asked both Guzzi and my dealer to check the oil pump when they installed the new cam & tappets back in June, both said there was no need to. I have only heard that slap - slap noise one other time, that is when the first set of cam & tappets went south. I am a very logical person and have a very good understanding of how engines work. I beleive there is a blockage in the oiling system with that bike or an issue with the oil pump. I even offered to pay to have the oil pan pulled to check things out when the second set of cams were replaced and both Guzzi and my dealer said it was not necessary. I went along with their logic, now I wish I had not.

Yes I miss the bike greatly, this was my 1st Guzzi, for 24K miles I loved the bike, but when the replacement cams went south I lost faith, when the slap - slap noise returned I knew it was time to make a move.

I have already reported it to NITSA.

Ride safe, I'm sure are paths will cross and Todd is probably correct, I'll own another Stelvio, but I going to wait for them to work out the bugs 1st.
 
Tappets went south, were replaced, oil pump was not inspected, oil delivery was not checked after the initial failure. As I've said before. Don't check the oil pump? All bets are off!

I take that since you found damage to the tapets you replaced them before you on sold it? Any chance of a few pics off the damage?

Pete
 
kwn306 said:
Wayne Orwig said:
Were the valve clearances changing with the new parts in there?
Click to expand...

Yes! Only on the right side, not the left. The left hand side was the one that went south the 1st time.

For those who asked, The oil was changed per Guzzi specs. with 10W-60 Agip. After the cam & tappets were changed I took Pete's advise and changed the oil every 3k rather than the 6K that Guzzi spec'ed.

I beleive it is a lubrication issue, I say that only going by the noise of the engine, no hard facts with a pressure gauge. The motor would sound healthy at a idle when hot, then all of a sudden I would hear a slap - slap for 3 to 7 seconds coming from the right side head, then it would go back to the normorl sound of ticky - ticky.

If I understand the dynamics of the 8v motor, the tappets should turn in the head while running for even wear, I beleive the slap - slap is the sound the tappet / cam was making when it is not turning because of lack of lubrication. I could be way off base, but that is my theroy.

I have my new GS, only ridden it 200 miles because of the rain we have been having here on the east coast of the USA. What I like...........the fuel injection, it's very smooth, the suppension, far superior to the Guzzi, what I miss........the torque of the Guzzi motor, it pulls like a old John Deere B tractor and for riding in the mountain roads in VA & WV that will be greatly missed, the BMW is a pig because it weighs so much.

I have heard of two 8v motors going south on the second set of cams & tappets, they were both in Europe. So there aren't a whole lot of issues.

That being said I asked both Guzzi and my dealer to check the oil pump when they installed the new cam & tappets back in June, both said there was no need to. I have only heard that slap - slap noise one other time, that is when the first set of cam & tappets went south. I am a very logical person and have a very good understanding of how engines work. I beleive there is a blockage in the oiling system with that bike or an issue with the oil pump. I even offered to pay to have the oil pan pulled to check things out when the second set of cams were replaced and both Guzzi and my dealer said it was not necessary. I went along with their logic, now I wish I had not.

Yes I miss the bike greatly, this was my 1st Guzzi, for 24K miles I loved the bike, but when the replacement cams went south I lost faith, when the slap - slap noise returned I knew it was time to make a move.

I have already reported it to NITSA.

Ride safe, I'm sure are paths will cross and Todd is probably correct, I'll own another Stelvio, but I going to wait for them to work out the bugs 1st.
Click to expand...

I think the red outlined words speaks volumes and should but probably wont allay fears about the present 8 Valve motor. This just proves that EVERY instance of the sky is falling should be thoroughly trashed and investigated before going bonkers. The latest word on the roller tappets is to quiet down the the noise, Well that noise on my 2011 Griso is almost non existent but just enough to let me know it is a Guzzi.
 
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