Ridemalibu Motorcycle Rentals & Tours – Los Angeles CA
  1. Ciao Guest - We're offering FREE shipping on orders over $99 for U.S. customers now through Monday (11/30) midnight PST. Use COVID-20-FREE at checkout on the STORE tab above — Please support small business! We wish the best to everyone; Stay healthy and hope you can get out and ride! Also, see our Newsletter link in the General Chat section below.

Carb conversion to 2013 single throttle body engine in a v65tt

Discussion in 'Quota & TT' started by GuzziV65TT, Dec 27, 2015.

  1. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Not sure if this is for the small block or v7 forum..!

    So I have a lovely pair of v65tt ( metalic grey 1984 and a white 1988) , both need thrust bearings and probably a crank polish and new shells, bit are getting hard to find for older small block bottom ends. Both gearbox's are getting old and occasionally stick in the lower gears

    I was offered a 2013 V7 Stone single throttle body engine and 5 speed box from a damaged v7 with 600miles on the clock by a friend and a plan to fit the complete 2013 engine and box to my grey TT


    I read the 4v conversion thread with interest and was interested to read that the v7 injector manifolds fit the lario heads as do the v7 exhausts . I cannot see a reason why the carb manifolds would not fit the v7 heads?

    Having looked a the two engine/box side by side i think i need :-


    2013 starter motor

    NGK VD05EM spark plug caps

    Ducati regulator

    Alternator mounted electronic ignition like Electronic Sachse

    --------------

    Only problem i can no see a route round is the cam shaft drive rev counter / tacho. Ideally I would like to use my v65TT cam shaft and front cover , this would give me the tacho drive and i could use my existing dyna s ignition
     
  2. mwrenn

    mwrenn Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Famiglia

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2011
    Messages:
    232
    Likes Received:
    50
    Location:
    Enid, OK
    That should work. To change the cam you will probably have to pull the heads and cylinders, otherwise the lifters will drop down into the engine when the cam comes out. No big deal pulling heads, as the intakes and exhausts are already off. Keep us posted with progress reports and pictures! Cool project!
     
    GuzziV65TT likes this.
  3. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom

    Cam swap is the interesting bit as I could keep my nearly new dyna S and lovely early LM1 tacho!

    I was thinking if i loosened the tappets so there was no pressure on the push rods I could turn the engine upside down and swap the cam with out the lifters falling into the block?
     
  4. GTM®

    GTM® Administrator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2009
    Messages:
    11,488
    Likes Received:
    3,579
    Location:
    Malibu
    If it were me, assuming everything will fit, I'd plug-and-play the engine/gearbox including the ECU/TB. To do this, you'd just need the factory harness and a few remote sensors like air box temp, and strip out anything not needed out of the plug. From there you could just add an electronic tachometer and electronic fuel pump. If you want to dig deeper, and as Mike says above, it could work but I'm betting both time and money would be better spent in trying to run it as is.
     
    GuzziV65TT likes this.
  5. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I looked at going with the full setup but i would need to mod the tank to add a fuel pump and I only managed to get the engine and box

    Im aiming to keep my TT 'original looking' but uses the latest engine with updated crank and all the niggles sorted
     
  6. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2008
    Messages:
    8,045
    Likes Received:
    869
    Location:
    Huntsville, AL

    You could use the external fuel pump and regulator from a 1993 to 2003 vintage California or EV. Just have the fuel return go back to before the fuel pump if you don't want to put a fitting on the tank for fuel return, or just use the other petcock opening for fuel return.
     
    GuzziV65TT likes this.
  7. mwrenn

    mwrenn Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Famiglia

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2011
    Messages:
    232
    Likes Received:
    50
    Location:
    Enid, OK
    Ah funny, I was not thinking of the engine being out of the bike. By all means you could turn it over and swap the cam. No problem.
    Good luck on the swap, sounds like fun, should be pretty easy to accomplish.
     
  8. sign216

    sign216 High Miler

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2009
    Messages:
    867
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Eastern, Massachusetts
    I like the quoted idea, but then again, I understand the need to "wrench beyond all reason."

    At a party last weekend, girlfriend was complaining of my need to "fix" a brand new Guzzi I had just bought.
     
  9. rbm

    rbm Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2012
    Messages:
    172
    Likes Received:
    31
    Location:
    Toronto
    Retort by drawing an analogy with her need to "accessorise" a perfectly fine looking new dress with shoes, jewellery, etc.
     
  10. abbienormal

    abbienormal High Miler GT Famiglia

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2008
    Messages:
    904
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Niles, OH
    rbm must be single like myself. Only single guys think they can make comments like that without repercussions. A friend's now ex-wife once complained when I used a multimeter to fix a bike in minutes he had been working on for hours that if he bought one he would only use it once a year and it would be a waste. I looked right at her and said she would buy a plate and put it on the shelf and never use it.
    Let's say I was not feeling the love.
     
  11. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Ok so project ultimate TT has started.

    Plan is to take a 600mile V7 stone engine and gearbox and fit them into my 1984 V65tt

    Having done a lot of research and measuring the niggle list is :-

    1) Standard gear ratio (primary gears) on a 2015 V7 is too high for a bike with 18" rear wheel[/li][/list]

    2) No output for a mechanical tacho or drive for points / dyna's

    3) will carb manifolds fit V7 Heads

    4) will exhaust fit v7 head

    5) what starter motor to use

    6) will V65 TT drive shaft splines fit new V7 gearbox ( 5-speed)

    7) mating v65tt wiring to ducati type regulator ( v7 stone crank nose is different from v65 etc, so have to use 320w ducati alternator

    8) Recessed spark plugs will need different caps)

    9) oil pressure and neutral wiring

    10) fitting swing arm

    11) breather plumbing

    12) remove timing sensor

    13) are frame mounts the same ( and will it fit!)
    ----------------------------------

    1) my v65TT has monza primary gears that are perfect for me, this also give same input spline size, removed bell housing on v65tt box and v7 stone box and primary gears swapped over with no problems!

    2) originally I had planned to use a v65 cam shaft and front cover, changed plan to fitting modern Elektronik-Sachse ZDG3 to the ducati alternator as I wanted the rev limiter and adjustable curves - cam and front cover from the v65 engine does fit if you want to go this route.

    I sourced a nice 80mm electronic chronographic tacho to replace the veglia mechanical unit

    3) the standard small block inlet manifold bolt straight on to the V7 Stone heads, you can even use the V7 bolts and gaskets, port matching almost perfect . Temp sensor on right hand head can be removed or poss utilised for a temp gauge?

    [​IMG]

    carbs and original air box all fit with no problems

    [​IMG]

    4) Standard V65 exhaust front pipes fit the V7 Stone head using v65 collets and flange, you need to loosen the front pipes from the silencers as the 750 block is slightly wider than the 650 but it all bolts up with good port matching and no issues one front pipes are move out a few mm. V7 or v65tt gaskets can be used

    [​IMG]

    5) the v65 valeo starter wont fit the later v7 bell housing, so I used the later one that came with the v7 stone engine/box. Battery lead and wiring connect up with no problems

    [​IMG]

    6) V7 gearbox casing is same as the v65 , and uses the same 12 spline shaft ( people with earlier small block that use 10 spline shafts would need to source a new shaft), v65 gear leaver ball joint fits back of box , as does the v65 clutch cable.

    [​IMG]

    7) mounted regulator to front of frame and connected direct to battery ( + and - ) , added frame ground , connect to switched ignition and connect dash charge light

    8) the guzzi oem spark plugs caps are very expensive but after a bit of digging they are NGK VD05EM 120deg LONG 5ohm plug caps, got 2 for less than �20 (GPB) delivered , v65 plug leads are shortened with wire cutters and the new caps screwed in

    [​IMG]


    9) swap round connector on oil pressure to later spade terminal, cut off plug from neutral switch and connect to v65 neutral light wire. charge and neutral lights both work as expected

    10) Swing arm mounts are identical to the v65 box ( and v35 box i have) and swing arm with spacer fitted straight on

    [​IMG]

    11) rocker box breathers and rear sump level oil return are identical to the v65 and you can just connect original pipes, i took option to add the v7 non return valve

    12) timing sensor gets bolts through the front timing cover ( near location where mechanical tacho feed fits) , had a 2mm stainless plate laser cut at work the blanks the hole ( used original bolts and o-ring) to stop dirt getting in or oil blowing out

    13) see pictures :)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Fuel tank clears the valve covers and the side covers clear the carbs


    --------------

    I cannot start the engine yet as the ignition kit has not arrived yet.

    interesting trivia the v65 and v7 stone rocker boxes are same underneath and if they look better I could use my original covers ( gaskets are the same)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    johnno, GTM® and abbienormal like this.
  12. johnno

    johnno Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2008
    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    14
    this is a wonderful thread ,i see your in the uk when you have finished the bike i would love to meet up and see this bike:clap:
     
    GuzziV65TT likes this.
  13. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Yeah I'll be up near you with it soon.. and not a 16inch wheel in site
     
  14. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    almost finished !


    Stainless cover to block old timing sensor hole

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    The finished article ( with her sister TT behind)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  15. pokeyjoe

    pokeyjoe High Miler

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2012
    Messages:
    753
    Likes Received:
    98
    Location:
    Long Beach, California
    Wow. That's some serious interchangeability. Good job.
     
  16. abbienormal

    abbienormal High Miler GT Famiglia

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2008
    Messages:
    904
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Niles, OH
    I am amazed that 2 bikes of different styles almost 30 years apart have that much in common. Congratulations on taking on the project and finishing it.
     
    GuzziV65TT likes this.
  17. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Im still shocked how easy it has been, will get a video up of her running soon.

    maybe the factory will notice and do a proper v7 scrabler ;-)


    Was in showroom earlier and recon the new 6 speed box would fit aslong as i have the newer lower frame rails to match.....
     
  18. johnno

    johnno Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Contributor

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2008
    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    14
    this is great news I can carry on riding my tt flat out knowing I can get a new engine for it LOL.
    I see you mention 16 inch wheels this would not be Iain of T5 fame would it?
     
  19. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    bust yeah that me Johnno! yeah flat out all the way for you!
     
  20. GuzziV65TT

    GuzziV65TT Cruisin' Guzzisti

    Joined:
    May 17, 2015
    Messages:
    109
    Likes Received:
    34
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    My Elektronik-Sachse ZDG3 ignition system (for ducati alternator) came today, took about 1hrs to fit and get setup on the V65TT / V7 hybrid


    Im very proud to announce that my Moto Guzzi V7TT :bike-037: Started FIRST TIME and runs really well

    Its -3 and the road out side my house is white with ice so no proper test rides today, but a quick ride up and down my 150m gravel drive shows it has lots and lots of grunt!


    Only minor niggle is the ignition pick up hits the plastic timing cover and needed spacing about 8mm, will cut a nice alloy spacer to finish the job tomorrow


    Will set the carbs up properly tomorrow but i am very very please with the results so far!
     

Share This Page