Old Jock said:
OJ,
You are correct, I read the post incorrectly. Main thing is not to read through the brushes, but directly on the slip ring. Also he may need to clean the slip rings for the brushes to make good contact.
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Leaking Voltage at Battery Earth
- Thread starter Supaflee
- Start date
OJ,
You are correct, I read the post incorrectly. Main thing is not to read through the brushes, but directly on the slip ring. Also he may need to clean the slip rings for the brushes to make good contact.
OldJock
Cruisin' Guzzisti
And who am I to disagree with you John, being only a "gifted amateur" myself 
Confirmation on the method of measurement would certainly help
To show how smart I am and to alert Supaflee, I made some edits to my post on page 6 with the wiring and open circuit generator tests. Please revisit it Supaflee before doing the checks
John
Confirmation on the method of measurement would certainly help
To show how smart I am and to alert Supaflee, I made some edits to my post on page 6 with the wiring and open circuit generator tests. Please revisit it Supaflee before doing the checks
John
Supaflee
Cruisin' Guzzisti
JZ and OJ .
With all the wiring off the generator , I record continuity between any two of the three stator's winding spade connectors .
Also I record .7ohms resistance between any two of the three spade connectors at the generator stator windings.
I've checked it with two meters and they each tell me the same , .7ohms RESISTANCE .
When the three yellow wires are (plug in some cases I understand) connected to the spades (lugs) at the stator , the recorded resistance at the rectifier plug end of the three yellow wires is nearly the same , .9ohms , ,1.1ohms and .8ohms.
Is this so far ok or not ?
Now OJ , All of your questions are answered YES up to Battery Voltage .
Then ,Battery Voltage +12.96
Ign off , Kill on =yes
Does charge light go on +yes
What voltage at DF at generator =11.82
What is battery voltage at this time =12.78
Did light go off when wire lifted from DF at generator=yes
Did it come back on again when DF reconnected at generator = Yes
Disconnect stator 1-2-3,run engine at 1500rpm.AC Voltage between any two lugs is 1.1volts , increase revs to 2000 voltage is 1.5 to 1.6 volts AC.
Puzzling eh ?
Regards Supaflee.
With all the wiring off the generator , I record continuity between any two of the three stator's winding spade connectors .
Also I record .7ohms resistance between any two of the three spade connectors at the generator stator windings.
I've checked it with two meters and they each tell me the same , .7ohms RESISTANCE .
When the three yellow wires are (plug in some cases I understand) connected to the spades (lugs) at the stator , the recorded resistance at the rectifier plug end of the three yellow wires is nearly the same , .9ohms , ,1.1ohms and .8ohms.
Is this so far ok or not ?
Now OJ , All of your questions are answered YES up to Battery Voltage .
Then ,Battery Voltage +12.96
Ign off , Kill on =yes
Does charge light go on +yes
What voltage at DF at generator =11.82
What is battery voltage at this time =12.78
Did light go off when wire lifted from DF at generator=yes
Did it come back on again when DF reconnected at generator = Yes
Disconnect stator 1-2-3,run engine at 1500rpm.AC Voltage between any two lugs is 1.1volts , increase revs to 2000 voltage is 1.5 to 1.6 volts AC.
Puzzling eh ?
Regards Supaflee.
OldJock
Cruisin' Guzzisti
Hi Supaflee
From what I can see its now down to rectifier, regulator, or generator rotor.
The 0.7 Ohms on the stator windings appear to be good and the wiring is good.
The next check is John Z's suggested resistance check on the rotor. Lift the DF brush off the rotor and make sure the copper slip rings are clean. Measure the resistance across the 2 rings.
You stated in an earlier post 3.5 Ohms, if it was done the way John suggests I would think that it's Ok.
If the resistance is Ok then I would think supplying the full field to the generator would be the move after that.
So if you can redo the rotor resistance check as per John Z's post and give us a value we can go from there.
That's all I got for now
John
From what I can see its now down to rectifier, regulator, or generator rotor.
The 0.7 Ohms on the stator windings appear to be good and the wiring is good.
The next check is John Z's suggested resistance check on the rotor. Lift the DF brush off the rotor and make sure the copper slip rings are clean. Measure the resistance across the 2 rings.
You stated in an earlier post 3.5 Ohms, if it was done the way John suggests I would think that it's Ok.
If the resistance is Ok then I would think supplying the full field to the generator would be the move after that.
So if you can redo the rotor resistance check as per John Z's post and give us a value we can go from there.
That's all I got for now
John
Supaflee
Cruisin' Guzzisti
OJ , I've just been and lifted the outer brush off it's slip-ring and measured the resistance across the two copper slip rings.
The resistance is 3.5 ohms.
Regards Supaflee
The resistance is 3.5 ohms.
Regards Supaflee
Supaflee
Cruisin' Guzzisti
OJ , I just ran the engine .
The bloody thing is charging .The battery voltage went up from 12.5 to 13.4 measured at the base of the terminals .
The generator light stays ON .
Somewhere I've inadvertantly made it so it goes and charges .
But whats with the idiot light staying on??
Supaflee
The bloody thing is charging .The battery voltage went up from 12.5 to 13.4 measured at the base of the terminals .
The generator light stays ON .
Somewhere I've inadvertantly made it so it goes and charges .
But whats with the idiot light staying on??
Supaflee
Supaflee said:
Look at the Schematic. With the system charging, you should be getting DC voltage through 3 diodes in the diode board to the DF connection. For some reason, you aren't getting this voltage which is why the bulb doesn't have 12 volts on each side thus going out. Short answer, replace the diode board.
OldJock
Cruisin' Guzzisti
It started charging??? :shock:
I see John Z posted up what looks to be the definitive answer, the signal diodes on the rectifier board.
You can test them by whipping the rectifier off the bike. With a 12V battery and a small 12V bulb, an instrument bulb would do. +12 - diode - bulb - -12, they should light the bulb in one direction but not the other.
John
I see John Z posted up what looks to be the definitive answer, the signal diodes on the rectifier board.
You can test them by whipping the rectifier off the bike. With a 12V battery and a small 12V bulb, an instrument bulb would do. +12 - diode - bulb - -12, they should light the bulb in one direction but not the other.
John
Supaflee
Cruisin' Guzzisti
Yep it's charging , a bit , but nowhere near what its meant to . JZ is 11.82 Volts at DF not enough ?
I'll wait for your answer before I rip into the diode board I think.
Thanks Guys Supaflee.
I'll wait for your answer before I rip into the diode board I think.
Thanks Guys Supaflee.
Supaflee
Cruisin' Guzzisti
JZ and OJ , you like me are going to be , "excited" , ( being the operative word here ) , with my news.
Just a few hours ago I figured that I'd ride the bike into a local electrics wizz here in Tauranga to change the diode board , as JZ suggested . I was getting pretty pissed with the bike and didnt want to bust anything . Seeing I was having trouble convincing myself that I loved my Guzzi , in fact.
So , warmed her up briefly and rode away . 3ks down the road ,and the generator light went out . I stopped , switched everything off, then started the engine again , generator light on . Gave her a rev to 2000 , generator light went off. So I rode away , happy as a pig in poo.
The Electrician Dude who was 10 ks away was already expecting me . He tested the charging of the battery and claened the sliprings some more . It takes the voltage up to 14volts now at 2000revs. Light goes out at 14/1500revs.
His answer to all of this , now that it's good is this :
The prior owner assembled the wiring wrongly.
Engine would run but not charge . Because he only rode the bike twice each year, and for 40 kms at a time , he needed to charge the battery to full before he could start it and go anywhere anyway . There is a real good chance he didnt know it was never charging .
The sliprings were black with muck when I cleaned them up just recently ,,,,,,,,,,, BUT WHAT I DIDNT DO WAS CLEAN THE CONTACT FACES OF THE BRUSHES . The grubby brushes re-introduced crap onto the sliprings .
The brushes didnt make "sufficient" contact with the sliprings to provide "EXCITATION" until several K's of riding.
Thanks JZ and OJ and all you other people for all your endless help and determination with my problem. It is now solved .
JZ , Im not going to bother trying to calculate how many hours of torment this has taken.Thank god I wasnt paying anyone to do it . However Im endebted to you and OJ. Thanks . I'll " button her up " tomorrow.
Supaflee
Just a few hours ago I figured that I'd ride the bike into a local electrics wizz here in Tauranga to change the diode board , as JZ suggested . I was getting pretty pissed with the bike and didnt want to bust anything . Seeing I was having trouble convincing myself that I loved my Guzzi , in fact.
So , warmed her up briefly and rode away . 3ks down the road ,and the generator light went out . I stopped , switched everything off, then started the engine again , generator light on . Gave her a rev to 2000 , generator light went off. So I rode away , happy as a pig in poo.
The Electrician Dude who was 10 ks away was already expecting me . He tested the charging of the battery and claened the sliprings some more . It takes the voltage up to 14volts now at 2000revs. Light goes out at 14/1500revs.
His answer to all of this , now that it's good is this :
The prior owner assembled the wiring wrongly.
Engine would run but not charge . Because he only rode the bike twice each year, and for 40 kms at a time , he needed to charge the battery to full before he could start it and go anywhere anyway . There is a real good chance he didnt know it was never charging .
The sliprings were black with muck when I cleaned them up just recently ,,,,,,,,,,, BUT WHAT I DIDNT DO WAS CLEAN THE CONTACT FACES OF THE BRUSHES . The grubby brushes re-introduced crap onto the sliprings .
The brushes didnt make "sufficient" contact with the sliprings to provide "EXCITATION" until several K's of riding.
Thanks JZ and OJ and all you other people for all your endless help and determination with my problem. It is now solved .
JZ , Im not going to bother trying to calculate how many hours of torment this has taken.Thank god I wasnt paying anyone to do it . However Im endebted to you and OJ. Thanks . I'll " button her up " tomorrow.
Supaflee
OldJock
Cruisin' Guzzisti
Well you got a result Supaflee and fixed some stuff along the way.
Was a bit of a marathon, but that's part of the joys of remote trouble shooting
You'll grow to love it all the more now its running properly and you learned some stuff to
John
Was a bit of a marathon, but that's part of the joys of remote trouble shooting
You'll grow to love it all the more now its running properly and you learned some stuff to
John