Merging a Tonti & Spine - trans compatibility

[SuperEvil]

I've searched for this, and can't find it addressed specifically. I'm sure some of you have seen this done.

I have a 79 CX100. Recently I bought a 96 Carb Sport 1100 to replace it. Now I've decided that I love the overall feeling of the tonti, but the engine of the spine. My garage is also heated.

Theres a lot more to this, but my main concern now is the transmission. I don't like the straight cut gearbox of the 1100, and the clutch on the 1100 is toast. My 5 speed tonti transmission is tight and right, but the housing is beat to hell, cosmetically. The Sport trans is clean clean and matches the engine housing.

Questions:
Are these transmissions interchangeable, more or less?
Should I be putting my helical gears in the Sport housing? Or is that a can of worms?
Am I going to be able to reuse the clutch in my CX in the 1100 engine?

Interested to hear from people who have been here, and what they course they took.

 

[GTM®]

SE, yes, it is a direct swap. I can't speak of the neutral switch between the two, but I've personally put a Centauro (straight cut) internals into the California housing with no issues. To speak to someone with the knowledge or have it done right, speak with Charlie Cole at; http://www.zydecoracing.com/services.html -- tell him we sent you.

Clutch wise, if it is even somewhat approaching it's service limits, replace it. It's a pretty big job that you'll be kicking yourself for not doing it if so.

 

[ARVENO]

I know one thing , in a Tonti Frame is possible swap the engine with a V11 engine, keeping the original ( tonti )gear box
so the 1100 sport engine, will fit as well.

Another thing i know is that Guzzi clutch ( 2 discs ) is the same for early tonti frames , california models ,V11, Breva .

From your post i understand you want to put the 1100 engine and trans in a Tonti Frame , is it correct ?

well , check this one out.....

http://www.motoborgotaro.com/custom-bik ... -lemans-2/

cheers
Marco

 

[Penis Rotor]

Another thing i know is that Guzzi clutch ( 2 discs ) is the same for early tonti frames , california models ,V11, Breva .

While the friction and intermediate plates are essentially the same the 1100 engined bikes and the Hi-Cams use a ten spring clutch assembly rather than the earlier eight spring one.

My understanding is that you want to put the helically cut six dog internals into the Sport case and run it in the spine frame? Is that correct? If so then the internals are a straight swap but the box will need shimming and I'd suggest not using the 3205ATN9 bearings used in the Sport box on the input and output shafts. You may also need to swap the needle rollers on the end of the output and cluster shafts.

If using the 1100 Sport motor you will need to use the Sport flywheel as this has the ignition triggers on it. It also provides for the 10 spring pressure plate which will be needed if you want to avoid frequent clutch changes due to slippage. You say the Sport clutch is worn out? How many miles has this machine done? Unless abused the twin platers last a LNG time as a rule....

Pete

 

[SuperEvil]

Thanks everyone.

My first post is a little vague on re-read. Here is what I want to do:
Put the Sport 1100 engine in my tonti frame, with all electronics,carbs, everything. This part is no problem.
Use the CX100 helical transmission internals... either in its current housing, or transferred to the Sport 1100 housing.
Everything else on the tonti frame will remain, including stock swing arm/drive and wheels. So the 1100 housing would need to work with that.

Based on what you guys are saying, Im thinking I'll just redo the clutch if it needs it. Pete, this is a low mileage engine, but my gut says that the PO wore down the friction material by riding the clutch. It slips under hi-revs and I'm out of adjustment. Cable is sound. I'll see for sure when I tear into it.

It seems the consensus is that everything works together, so I can go any route I please. I won't be using a neutral indicator, so it might come down to aesthetics and input wear. My last loop frame had heavy scoring in the input shaft on the casing, so I'll be looking for that for sure. I may send the whole mess to Charlie Cole for shimming if budget allows.

 

[Penis Rotor]

You will need to swap the gearbox endcase at the very least as the 1100 box doesn't have the cast flange the boot o the swingarm affixes to.

Also, with the clutch. You do know there are three adjustment points. The adjuster on the lever mount. The adjuster at the other end of the cable and the grub screw and lock- nut on the operating arm on e back of the box?

With Sports C's especially as the arm moves back as the clutch wears them arm can end up jammed against the gearbox mounting bracket, preloading the thrust bearing and causing the clutch to slip. Undoing the locknut and wining the grub screw out a bit allows the arm to move forward again so it no longer preloads the operating mechanism. Adjustment is always a bit of a juggling act using the three points. Getting to the grub screw on an early spines is NOT an easy task mind.

Pete