Saddlebag leakage?

[abbienormal]

I have not ridden my new California Touring but I brought it home in an open trailer in some snow. Naturally I had to wash it off. The next day I get into the saddlebags to look at the owners manual and there is about a 1/4 cup of water in each bag. I had heard these bags were made by Givi so I expected a water tight seal. Is this common? My Norge bags leaked badly until I had the new updated seal installed. I do not expect anything but water tight on a modern bike. I had looked in the bags when I bought the bike and they were dry.

 

[vinnychoff]

have you checked the seals. have you applied a little silicon grease. I think a quick wipe with the grease will see if they are sealing all along. I have a soft top that often needs the seals cleaning and then a quick wipe with silicon grease to seal back up

 

[abbienormal]

I am waiting to see if they leak again giving them the benefit of doubt. If they do I will first want new seals as a new bike should not leak. I will try the silicone trick if that does not fix it. I used to use the silicone on the removeable to of my Honda Del Sol and it does help. This may just be from bringing it home in below freezing weather in the snow then hosing it off since nobody else has the problem.

 

[ploose]

Mine leaks as well. Water comes in below the lid ant the rear between the rear and front mold sections of the panier close to lock/latch. The paniers have no seal where they are fitted together as far as I can see....silicon might be the solution....have not worked on the issue yet but agree that it is a NO NO for a modern bike...hardly rains in Italy I guess...

 

[abbienormal]

I have a new theory on the leakage. I took a short 60 mile ride on the bike and got a fair amount of salt on it so I gave it a hose down when I got home. I was careful around the lids but forgot to check after I washed it. A few days later I was adjusting the shocks a bit stiffer and had to remove the left bag. There was water in it. So I sat it on my floor creeper I was using to reach the right shock and when I picked it up there was water on the creeper. I am thinking the seam where the bags are assembled together with screws is the culprit. I plan on hitting the seam with a hose and watching inside or the next time the bag is off placing it in a wash basin full of water and see if it leaks in.

 

[abbienormal]

I tested my theory and it is the seam between the two halves of the bag that leaks. There may be other spots like the mounting bolt holes or the seals but I I know the seam does. I took a garden hose on spray, not stream, and hit the front lower corner of my let saddlebag. In about 10 seconds or less I had water coming through the seam.
A dealer I have spoken to that I have found out almost everything he told me about the new Cali was B.S. told me these bags are made by Givi. I find that really hard to believe as I have never seen a Givi bag leak. Any body know? Supposedly the Norge bags are Hepco and Becker. Those leaked until I got the seal replaced then they only leaked very little.
Normally a little leak is tolerated but an $18000 bike in 2014? Not acceptable.

 

[abbienormal]

I just got the word from my dealer. He reported my complaint that the bags leak and the Guzzi rep said "They are not waterproof"! Who Hoo. Gotta love Italian manufacturers. :roll:

 

[abbienormal]

Possible fix

I may have found a fix. Funny how the "Not water proof" bags have o'rings around the hinge mounts and rubber gaskets on the mounting bolts. I removed the bags from the bike and the lids from the bags. I then sealed all around, including the upper portion by rotating the bags around while spraying so the entire seam of the 2 halves of the bag were sealed from the front of the opening to the back. The wonder spray used was Rustoleum Leak Seal in clear. I have since ridden in rain off and on for several hours and washed the bike once. Not a definitive test but I can say it was dry and as the first picture shows how much water got in after a quick washing before I sealed them it is much better. I used 4 coats. I still had some left in the can and I probably put the first two coats too heavy. It does not dry to touch in the time on the can unless maybe perfect conditions. I left them in front of my heater for 3 days then reassembled them. I then left the lids open till I got to go for a ride which was a couple of weeks. So far I am happy.

 

[abbienormal]

A report on my fix. Not sure where they are leaking now but I suspect the lid. I was on a 10 day 3,300 mile ride and had varying intensity of rain off and on for at least 7 of those days. *Warning: In case of drought have me ride through". The left bag still leaked but nowhere near as bad as originally. The right bag almost was dry but some minor water inside. I'll have to keep at it.
On the plus side the only problem I had was a heat shield coming loose. When I first got the bike (used with 500 miles on it) I pulled a screw off the left side shield to locktite all of them and found it had been done. Figuring they all were I went no further. Looking at this it seems not or the locktite just burned off from the heat.
Very comfortable touring bike.

 

[abbienormal]

As further time has passed I now see the Rustoleum sealer I used has decided not to adhere to the plastic very well and it is now peeling off. My current plan is to remove it then scuff the plastic a bit and try something else. Have to do some research first. I might contact Rustoleum to see if their paint for plastic outdoor furniture applied first might make a good primer.

 

[roadventure]

As further time has passed I now see the Rustoleum sealer I used has decided not to adhere to the plastic very well and it is now peeling off. My current plan is to remove it then scuff the plastic a bit and try something else. Have to do some research first. I might contact Rustoleum to see if their paint for plastic outdoor furniture applied first might make a good primer.

You have probably seen this "as seen on TV" product:

http://www.target.com/p/as-seen-on-...pid=14275441&gclid=CJeR_Kuo1MECFaIF7AodLR0AQw

I wonder if it is any different than the Rustoleum product? Also, I don't have any saddlebags to look at, but as I recall, they are not a one piece molded part. I remember what looked like points where fasteners (screws, rivets?) are used to attach the outer colored shell to the black inner shell. If this is true, can the two pieces be separated and reassembled? If so, I would think that a thin line of silicone sealant would solve leaking if this area is the source.

 

[abbienormal]

I was going to use the "As seen on TV" stuff but I saw the Rustoleum came in clear and was a name brand. Figured I'd try it.
The dealer told me MG told them to never take the bags apart as you will not get them back together. I am seriously contemplating putting that to the test and some Loctite 515 or similar. Silicone never seems to hold up on plastic like this.

 

[roadventure]

I was going to use the "As seen on TV" stuff but I saw the Rustoleum came in clear and was a name brand. Figured I'd try it.
The dealer told me MG told them to never take the bags apart as you will not get them back together. I am seriously contemplating putting that to the test and some Loctite 515 or similar. Silicone never seems to hold up on plastic like this.

Good point about silicone sealant on plastic (ABS, I presume?) Whatever you try, it will need to be compatible with the plastic saddlebag, for sure. Where I work we are making custom Polaris four-wheelers. I'll have to go out into the shop and ask what sealants they are using on the plastic parts. I'll let you know if I learn anything helpful.

 

[abbienormal]

I have decided to take a chance and see if I can unscrew the two halves of the saddlebags, put some sealer in the gap and screw them back together. I do not plan to take them all the way apart or the screws all the way out. I initially had very little leakage after I sprayed the sealer inside so I think I am on track.
Since Moto Guzzi very inaccurately calls the saddlebags fiberglass in the option listing for the custom does anybody know what type of plastic they are made of? I did a bit of checking and Loctite lists their waterproof silicone for fishtanks, among other uses, as being able to bond abs.

 

[roadventure]

Since Moto Guzzi very inaccurately calls the saddlebags fiberglass in the option listing for the custom does anybody know what type of plastic they are made of? I did a bit of checking and Loctite lists their waterproof silicone for fishtanks, among other uses, as being able to bond abs.

You may be able to find a molded-in identification of the plastic type. The plastic parts on my Venture and Tour Deluxe all has "ABS" molded in at some location. But those were Japanese bikes and this is Italian.........

 

[abbienormal]

I found the recycling arrows. Funny thing is no number in it. Good old Google brought me this:
"When the number is omitted, the symbol is known as the universal Recycling Symbol, indicating generic recyclable materials. In this case, other text and labels are used to indicate the material(s) used."
It does say PA-GB15 under it and some more Google work brought me this info:
15% glass bead reinforced Polyamide 6 compound, UV-stabilized
From this page: http://www.campusplastics.com/campus/de/datasheet/SCHULAMID®+6+GB+15+LS/A.+Schulman+GmbH/1/c62c134e
So I guess I need something compatible with a Polyamide plastic.
The bags are marked "Made In Italy" much to my surprise. I figured they were made by Shad like the trunk. But then, the trunk doesn't leak.

 

[roadventure]

15% glass bead reinforced Polyamide 6 compound, UV-stabilized

So I guess I need something compatible with a Polyamide plastic.

Maybe you should give the guys at Henkel (Loctite) a call and ask what they sell that they could recommend for success.

http://www.henkelna.com/brands-1556.htm?nodeid=8797571317902

Here's another question. Is the outer shell the same material as the inner shell?

 

[mikeaedmonds]

I too have leaking saddlebags, i did notice while cleaning the bike that the gap between the top lid and the saddlebags is bigger on the outside part of the bag, and smaller closer to the bike or bag mounts. This is noticeable when opening and closing the bag latch, when watching the gap between the top lid and the bag. I havent looked into why this is, i didnt see it before. I thought it might be because of sagging as the outside, furthest away from the bike, has the biggest gap.

Cant see it much in the below photo. The gap on the right side of the latch is bigger than on the left side of the latch.

 

[abbienormal]

Looking at my bags the gap is also uneven. I have proven to myself that the majority of my water leakage comes from the seam between the bags.
The recycling code on both halves of the bags is the same.
I called Loctite. They said good luck finding something that will seal and adhere to this plastic unless I want to glue the bags together. That may be a later attempt. I took my left bag apart today and found the black portion has a channel that fits over the painted section (white in my case) and there is a rubber seal tucked in the groove. I think this is why Guzzi said you will never get them back together because the rubber started removing itself while they are apart. I ordered some Loctite 908570 silicone sealer made for sealing doors, fish tanks etc. I am debating removing the rubber entirely and filling the groove with this or just applying it in addition. There is even a 1/2" (12mm) long gap right in a corner where there is no rubber. The white stuff on the black is the spray sealer I tried earlier. I noticed it was behind the screw bosses in some places meaning they were not bottomed out.
[AT

 

[mgmike]

Wow...Ill go with the Hepko bags when I decide to get some...