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Sizzling Saprisa

geodoc

geodoc

Cruisin' Guzzisti
Joined
Oct 27, 2008
Messages
205
My Tonti hot-rod was in storage for the winter, but with a bit of sun peaking out, decided to fire it up and get it ready for Spring.

Seemed to be fine, but the Moto Spezial speedo display was flashing "charging error" before the whole gage went TU. A little investigating showed that I had on over charging condition - no control at all, voltage right up past 15V at less than 2000 RPM.

It's got a Saprisa system that was working fine all last year. Proceeded to check for tight connections, loose grounds, etc. Had proper battery voltage indications at the appropriate leads with switch on but not running. Consulted Guzziology for ideas. It mentions many Saprisa faults are due to poor grounding of the regulator. Installed an additional ground lead between regulator and engine case where the battery is also grounded. Fired it up and still over voltage.

OK ................ get a new regulator, after all, what else could it be? Installed, drank a cup of coffee and started and ............................ s**it ............. still over charging.

The Saprisa system Googles little of value for trouble shooting tips. With a Bosch system there's a bit of cheating you can do to test things, but not non that I'm aware of with the permanent magnet Saprisa.

So ........... anybody been down the Saprisa over charging road and emerged victorious? How'd you get there?

GD
 
Dunno, George. I have had a Saprisa on mine for a few years with no problems. I was told that it is absolutely critical to keep the regulator cool, but I think the failure mode for an overly hot Saprisa is zero voltage, and does not explain the issue with your second unit.

I thought the ground wire on my Saprisa was a little punk (~18 ga), so I did beef it up at install time, AND grounded the case.

I presume you have a good ground on your Moto Speziale unit.

Wot's "TU"?
 
Heh Shane,

The Saprisa system was bought new from MG Cycle to install on this project bike. I had a Saprisa on my other 850T-based hot rod for years without trouble.

Yeah, after reading about potential ground faults with the Saprisa set-up in Guzziology, I installed a nice big fat one from the bare aluminum plate the regulator mounts too rather than relying on the star washers under that plates mounting screws to dig through the frame paint and ground it. Although it was working that way before. But like I said, the additional ground didn't work with either the original regulator or the new one.

The regulator is mounted under the front of the seat to an aluminum .1 in. thick plate about 6" wide and 18" long that also provides mounting places for other electrical components.

The picture at the bottom shows the mounting arrangement.

And yes, the Moto Spezial gage is grounded pretty well.

Oh ................... TU = "tits up"



Shane said:
Dunno, George. I have had a Saprisa on mine for a few years with no problems. I was told that it is absolutely critical to keep the regulator cool, but I think the failure mode for an overly hot Saprisa is zero voltage, and does not explain the issue with your second unit.

I thought the ground wire on my Saprisa was a little punk (~18 ga), so I did beef it up at install time, AND grounded the case.

I presume you have a good ground on your Moto Speziale unit.

Wot's "TU"?
Click to expand...
 
That's the "Ducati" alternator in that Daytona diagram - rather a different fish.

Here's a pretty good diagram of a typical Saprisa system installed in a LeMans 1:

http://www.richcutler.co.uk/guzzi/downl ... iagram.pdf

john zibell said:
geodoc,

I did a little digging, and it looks like just two wires exit the stator. Check the output AC voltage. If it is very high, it may be more than the rectifier/regulator can handle. You might want to reference the Ducati electrica parameters to have something to go by. See pdf page 139 of this manual http://www.guzzitek.org/atelier/gb/1000 ... _GB%29.pdf
Click to expand...
 
That looks like a poorly designed circuit for charging. No wonder they switch to the Ducati system. Well, that said, the two yellow leads are producing ac current. I'd check the output from there to see what you are getting. The usual fault is not enough juice supplied, the overcharging is very unusual.
 
I think you have a problem on the voltage sensing input to the regulator.
You can find the tech info here. http://www.aetsa.com/eng/entrada_produc ... _note.html
The one Guzzi used is the OPS one, with the centre tap of the stator windings going to the battery positive. Thus you have two negative coils out of phase, which are fed to the rectifier.
The regulator has 4 connections, plus the case to earth. Two are AC from the stator, one is to the warning light, and the other is switched via the ignition, and is the reference voltage for the regulator. If there is a high resistance connection in that feed, or it is disconnected somehow, then the regulator will see low volts there, so will boost the output accordingly.
 
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