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Tappet noise & strange result of valve adjustment

Discussion in 'Griso-Bella Chat & Tech' started by sohcfour, May 4, 2015.

  1. Goodvibes

    Goodvibes Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    Stuart
    Makes sense. Really don't see how rollers over flaters really solves much. I've had no issues with my flat tappet motor (w/cam recall of course at PDI) for 33K miles. And the lash adjustments have been unnecessary in the last two attempts. I don't do short trips, nor do I let it idle while I gear up. Use the recommended AGIP and OCI's.
     
  2. thirdguzzi

    thirdguzzi Just got it firing!

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    Just got back from 2000 mile blast around Germany. Got to Dover, queuing for passport control etc. lots of stop/starting, then on starting again it made a shocking noise, only went away by a 'kill or cure' fist full of throttle. It went away!! Periodic clanking on a very hot engine over the next few days, but generally only on a very hot engine or first thing in the morning on low revs - so cold engine. Again, a fist full of throttle made it go away - I am usually very mechanically sympathetic but it gets to a point where 'one' has enough. Me thinking of oil pump not quite doing its job? It was never replaced by dealer when the cams went. Can't find a price for replacement yet...I'm sure it'll be cheap! Ha. I know guzzi engines are noisy, but this is ridiculous when it happens.

    Being in a colder climate I assume stuffing a pair of old socks in the oil cooler may help?!? No thermostat on the oil cooler then?
     
  3. thirdguzzi

    thirdguzzi Just got it firing!

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    Latest roller lifters were fitted.
     
  4. thirdguzzi

    thirdguzzi Just got it firing!

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    .....and this evening, a couple of miles filtering on the motorway led to the return of the clanking and 'tappet tinkle', which again disappeared straight away when I got past the traffic jam. I never had any of the noises before the cams disintegrated. Still thinking about trashed oil pump?
     
  5. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

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    That is possible if a complete tear down isn't performed during a cam update. Our old friend Pete Roper was adamant about this.
     
  6. Mark111

    Mark111 Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Contributor

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    Third,

    Alright then, don't want to cast a shadow over your enjoyment of the bike but is very reminiscent of my recent experience with an 8v engine.

    A couple of Thousand Km's after a recent tappet replacement abnormal and intermittent noises developed in my engine under similar conditions to what you describe.

    Initially thought it was related to the valve train but a more educated opinion diagnosed a likely problem with the bottom end.

    This resulted in the engine being pulled down to discover that the big end bearing shells were damaged most likely from random material circulating in the engine as a result of the Tappet failure. This was confirmed by removing the oil gallery blanking plugs in the crank which showed a number of pieces of shrapnel caught up inside the oil galleries.

    Further investigation confirmed minor damage to the interior of the oil pump as well.

    The upside to this is that the crank was barely marked and will only require a minor clean up and all other components are sound, so once new bearing shells are installed and the oil pump replaced as a precaution (could have been reused but would always be playing on my mind) the engine will be good to go. If this occurred to some other less robust engines the crank etc. might have been throw away jobs.

    Downside: haven't had a ride for weeks while we wait for parts and the cost.

    I seriously recommend that you have the engine looked at ASAP as if the circumstances are the same as mine (they sound like it) then prolonged use will potentially destroy a repairable engine.

    After initially having a massive case of the shits about the whole episode, reality kicked in when I realised that the only major casualty here was my ailing bank account.

    This, if you think about it is pretty insignificant when you take note of the horrible things that occur to all sorts of unfortunate bastards all around the world on a daily basis, both the bike and I will live on.

    Good luck

    Mark
     
  7. thirdguzzi

    thirdguzzi Just got it firing!

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    Thanks Marks. Agree with your comments about properly unfortunate bastards around the world - wholeheartedly! And I have kept it in perspective - this year riding round the north France WW1 battlefields I did think I had it easy!

    I have just got it back from the dealer. They'd pulled the engine apart. Everything is clean and looking good. Oil pump, big end bearings, oil filters, oil pressure relief valves, cams...everything looks good, is working fine and shows no signs of damage or wear! They are totally stumped and seemed embarrassed at charging me for the work. They put new cam chains, followers and tensioners in, as a precaution so I feel well supported by them. So the next few miles will be interesting.

    Oh and whilst I was chatting to the dealer I get a text from 'me mate' with a Stelio....one of his cams has gone again, 4 years after replacement BUT they were replaced 'like for like' with the original design and did not have the latest modification..

    Cheers
     
  8. thirdguzzi

    thirdguzzi Just got it firing!

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    Well...I've had the cam chains and followers replaced and so far (about 300 miles) no noise! Let's hope that's it!
     
  9. klaas123

    klaas123 Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    The flat tappet problems were never solved by Guzzi, every flat tappet 8V engine will sooner or later need the conversion to rollers.
     
  10. John Warner

    John Warner Cruisin' Guzzisti GT Contributor

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    There's no thermostat in the Oil system.
    I've blanked off the lower half of my (Stelvio) Oil Cooler for Winter, and am in the process of fitting an Oil Temp Gauge, sensor will be in the R/H Oil Line Banjo Bolt.
    I've also blanked off the Fairing Ducts, to reduce the Airflow over the Rocker Covers, has the added bonus of keeping my Knees warm too.
     

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