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V7 III First Service ?

Discussion in 'V7/V85/V9 Chat & Tech' started by Nick Gann, Aug 3, 2017.

  1. decotriumph

    decotriumph Tuned and Synch'ed GT Contributor

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    Sloan's. If you want your local dealer to stay in business, then you need to give them your business.
     
    NorthernProducer likes this.
  2. roadscum

    roadscum Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    The local dealer here that dropped them told me MG owed him $40k for warranty works. Maybe I took his comment too literally or perhaps things have changed...... dunno?

    Paul
     
  3. Kev M

    Kev M Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    Well that would automatically rule that dealer out.

    The only thing worse than a dealer so stupid they might claim to be owed $40k for warranty work would be a dealer actually stupid enough to let the bill get that high.

    Either way, nevermind.
     
    JACoH likes this.
  4. roadscum

    roadscum Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    They've always treated me well and have taken very good care of my bike....... without any issues. Whatever they may be, I have no complaints and highly recommend them. About 2 years ago they took on Guzzi again and are now having 2nd thoughts. Here they are, fine folks indeed: http://www.eurocyclesoftampabay.com/

    Paul
     
  5. Nick Gann

    Nick Gann Just got it firing!

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    As ridiculous as this seems man, I didn't even think about them selling just the parts I wanted... I was thinking about them only doing the maintenance. Went by today and got the parts... had it all on hand! Which is awesome since otherwise everywhere I look at online tells me parts are not in stock and itll be a month since the Italians are on a month long holiday. So thanks for the (now very obvious) tip!
     
    Trout, roadscum and decotriumph like this.
  6. Nick Gann

    Nick Gann Just got it firing!

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    Doing the work myself today... I posted in another thread but then it dawned on me to check here and with you... what valve clearances does this v7III like? Haven't checked on the bike yet but the manual doesn't list anything. Figured I would check here just in case I get out there and don't find those numbers anywhere.

    Molt up there lists some numbers but it is worth more than one opinion since he was talking about a previous engine. Also the fluid he mentions at 85w-90, the manual says 75w-90... not a knock on him, but I want to make sure the numbers are correct.
     
  7. JACoH

    JACoH Cruisin' Guzzisti

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    I believe either 75w-90 or 80w90 or 85w90 all would be satisfactory, depends on the brand. Agip has 85w90, Motul has 75w90.
    Sticker on the rear fender specifies valve clearances as 0.15mm intake and 0.20mm exhaust which is what my dealer tech recommends. Although the service manual which you can download here says 0.10mm intake and 0.15mm exhaust.
     
  8. Nick Gann

    Nick Gann Just got it firing!

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    Thanks so much dude! I was just about to walk out and check the bike for the numbers... and the email notified me of a response. Really appreciate your time and response man. First Guzzi and want to make sure I give her everything she needs the right way :)
     
    Trout likes this.
  9. Nick Gann

    Nick Gann Just got it firing!

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    Welp all done and valves were solid, did not need any adjustment... all new fluids and took her for a test drive. She's a happy girl. Thanks to everyone who helped me on the project! Now on to other threads with new questions...
     
  10. usedtobefast

    usedtobefast Tuned and Synch'ed GT Famiglia

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    Came across this thread as I'll be looking at a first service soon on my V7 III Racer.

    And wow, some great prices mentioned on the first service! In my area it is $540!! :sweating: That is the total, all oils, washers, etc, but still, wow, painful.

    I was thinking first service with the dealer, good idea and all that. But what better way to get to know my motorcycle than to do it myself.

    Mechanic wise, I've done valve adjustments on Honda V Fours, and that actually wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. Also have always done my own valve adjustments on KTM RFS engines, Suzuki DR650, etc. So the Guzzi seems dead simple.

    But I do have a couple of questions:
    1. The service manual does not call for the final drive oil change at first service ... but I see guys references the final drive oil and saying to do that then. Any reason to change that so early?

    2. For valve adjustment, one way to not worry about TDC is ... rotate motor, see intake start being pushed down, this means for certainty the exhaust is closed, so check exhaust clearance then. Then rotate motor, see exhaust valve starting to be pushed, means intake is closed, check intake. Would that technique be OK with this valve train?
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2018
  11. john zibell

    john zibell Moderator Staff Member GT di Razza Pura

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    Probably not, plus it is allot of rotating and checking. Finding TDC is not difficult. The first part is good, look for the intake beginning to open. Then continue to rotate and use a plastic straw or small wooden dowel (or similar device) to feel piston travel. Feel for the piston to rise, and when it stops rising, you are at TDC. Check both valves at the same time and be done with that side.

    As to changing the gearbox and rear drive oils at the first service. It probably isn't and absolute necessity, but it will remove any initial wear metals that may contaminate the oil. In other words, may not be a great benefit, but it wouldn't hurt either.
     
    usedtobefast likes this.
  12. Godfrey

    Godfrey High Miler GT Famiglia

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    I have always replaced all lubricants at the first service time. If the bike has a separate transmission and rear drive, I do them too. The only lubricant I don't change is the fork oil ... and I've often felt I ought to. It's a matter, to me, of being sure that everything on the bike is up to snuff and any crud left over from initial assembly and generated during break-in is removed.

    DON'T set valve clearances at anything other than TDC Compression. I've seen many people try to do it the way you suggest and, while it seems it should work in theory, in practice it seems to always end up that the clearances are wrong. Just take the plugs out and turn the engine over to get TDC Compression on one cylinder ... do the valve clearances ... then turn it over again to get TDC Compression on the other ... do those valves ... and you're done. Simple, easy; doesn't have to be absolutely precise. A straw or a chopstick work great as a feeler to determine TDC.

    I had the dealer (CSS) do my first service. Yes, it's kind of pricey, but they did a complete, FULL service, end to end, and did it while I waited. The mechanic caught several small details that I know I would not have seen, and took care of them for me gratis. He also spent the time to show me how to adjust the throttle free play on the push-pull throttle assembly correctly. The cost was $595 total, all consumables plus labor and any tax, etc, included; I felt that was a bit'o'dosh but worth it given the excellent job that was done. (It's far better than the $800 first service price I was quoted on the Ducati Scrambler, which didn't even include a valve clearance check(!) and likely didn't include the cost of consumables or any sales tax... )

    To me, the first service (just like the Pre-Delivery Setup) is a critical piece of the bike's service life and can affect the future of the bike's reliability and durability quite a lot. While I'm perfectly capable of doing both myself, I find it worth it to have an experienced hand who's done it many times on a given bike model do it for me when I'm new to the particular machine.

    G

    BTW: I had Racer out for three rides this week so far. Nothing long or far, but I am so happy with how the boy goes! :D
     
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  13. usedtobefast

    usedtobefast Tuned and Synch'ed GT Famiglia

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    Ok, Ok, I'll do the straw and TDC. On a KTM RFS the valve spring pressure rapidly turns the crank and spits the straw 10-15 feet across the garage. Kind of exciting.
     
  14. usedtobefast

    usedtobefast Tuned and Synch'ed GT Famiglia

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    Godrey - I hear you on the "hands of the professional" thing. But I'm still thinking, it is my bike, time for me to get to know it well. I have the service manual with all the steps and excellent bolt torque information. I'd like to see what the valve clearances are at, which bolts needed torquing, what did the magnetic drain plugs look like, what did the oil that came out look like, etc.

    I figure I need some Guzzi grease under my fingernails!

    The only thing in the service manual that had me going :worried: was the "Determination of Crankshaft Clearance". But that isn't done by the professionals at the first service anyway.
     
  15. Godfrey

    Godfrey High Miler GT Famiglia

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    I've checked various bolts every couple of weeks to see what's loosening up, what needed tightening, etc. I've also spent pleasant afternoons with the parts and service book just sitting on my stool examining where everything is, figuring out how I'd access it, and of course I have done all of the incidental stuff (like disabling the EVAP system, replacing the mufflers, flashing the ECU, fitting the bar end weights and mirrors, changing the headlamp bulb, replacing the crappy little 4mm clip nuts that break so easily with better quality ones, etc) myself.

    Hint: the steps in the service manual to remove and replace the mufflers are way more than you need to do. Each muffler can be removed by undoing just the pipe clamp and then removing the main hanger bolt... :D

    Next job up is installing the SAS block off kit. That's a bit more involved since you have to raise up the tank a little to get access to the bolts and hoses properly, but I figure it will take me an hour or two at my usual slow pace. Just waiting for a warmish day in the garage ... It's been too cold down there.

    Adjusting the valves, checking the detritus on the drain plugs ... Well, the mechanic who did the first service told me precisely what he found, and frankly his judgement about what is notable is better than mine at first service time for this bike: "Just the usual little bit of swarf on the drain plugs, nothing to worry about. I did a quick check of the swingarm splines, they are properly greased so nothing needed there. Your valves were about normal that I've seen: the exhausts were a little tight after run-in, everything set properly now. ..." etc. That tells me more than a self-done first service on an unfamiliar machine can.

    Yes: it's your machine and your decision to service it the way you want to. Nothing wrong with either approach. Guzzis are pretty easy to service overall, there's no reason not to do it yourself other than for convenience or to take advantage of a pro's experience while unfamiliar. The plus side of having the bike serviced at a shop is that the full service is just what was done for the first service, so a full service at the next stop doesn't cost you twice as much as it usually does with many other bikes, and it's no more difficult to do. The downside is that the first service is a bit more expensive.

    I chose to let the dealer do the service to take advantage of their experience with an unfamiliar machine and also because it was a way to become more knowledgeable about their service folks ... The price was an acceptable exchange for that, and knowing Guzzis as well as I do already, it was nice to hear some of the subtleties of this model in the eyes of an experienced mechanic, and to see that I can actually trust their mechanic to do a good job if I need work done that I don't have time to do...

    it's all good. :D
     
  16. GuzziTex

    GuzziTex Just got it firing! GT Contributor

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    In the service manual it says to check the engine oil level with the stick inserted but not screwed in; with bold face type. Two paragraphs later it says to unscrew it, wipe it clean, screw it back in all the way, then unscrew to check level. The second version matches the owner's manual instructions. Is this just an error in the service manual text? Which is correct? It would certainly affect the oil level.
     
  17. Trout

    Trout GT Reference

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    Welcome to the world of Guzzi where our motto is:
    "Guzzi making mechanics out of riders since 1921"

    How I check the oil:
    Loosen dipstick.
    Sit on bike & hold in upright position.
    Take dipstick out.
    Wipe clean.
    Re-Insert dipstick without screwing in.
    Take dipstick out & check level.

    Please note that with all the Guzzi's I have owned in the past 45 years ALL of them run a 1/2 qt low.
    I have never owned a small block but believe they are the same.
    If you try to maintain oil at the full level it will just blow out thru the breather.
     
  18. GuzziTex

    GuzziTex Just got it firing! GT Contributor

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    Sounds similar to the Ural I had. Urals also make mechanics out of riders. I'm thinking it is one of those things in the manual where the translation to English sometimes gets slightly wrong. Your method makes sense with regard to the breather blow by. Urals do that too. People would add drip legs to the vent plumbing to collect and drain the blow-by.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2018
  19. Kubbie

    Kubbie Tuned and Synch'ed

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    That's funny, bought my 16' Griso from them August 11th. Already replaced the speedo under warranty, fogged over lens, and waiting on the replacement seat to be delivered.
     

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