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Reassembling the Eldorado

Freebirdbeachbum

Freebirdbeachbum

Cruisin' Guzzisti
Joined
Jun 10, 2016
Messages
104
Location
Space City, Texas
I'm ready to start reassembling my Eldorado and I've two big questions:

1. When mounting the engine and gearbox to the frame, is it preferable to mate them first (also, what lube is recommended on the splines)?

2. Is it preferable to build-out a rolling frame before mounting the engine and gearbox in 1 above?

Thanks,

Ken
 
1. I prefer to install the engine into the frame first (front engine bolt through mounts) first, then tilt the engine forward and install the transmission. Much easier if you're doing it by yourself.

2. I find it easiest to install the engine and transmission into a bare frame and build up from there.
This blog I wrote years ago may help; thisoldtractor.com/projects_barney_blog_2007-08-07_2007-08-07.html

I don't use any lube on the splines of the clutch hub or flywheel. On the output shaft, driveshaft and rear drive splines I use Wurth SIG3000 which is available from MG Cycle.
 
Last edited:
Amboman said:
1. I prefer to install the engine into the frame first (front engine bolt through mounts) first, then tilt the engine forward and install the transmission. Much easier if you're doing it by yourself.

2. I find it easiest to install the engine and transmission into a bare frame and build up from there.
This blog I wrote years ago may help:
https://www.thisoldtractor.com/projects_barney_blog_2007-08-07_2007-08-07.html

I don't use any lube on the splines of the clutch hub or flywheel. On the output shaft, driveshaft and rear drive splines I use Wurth SIG3000 which is available from MG Cycle.
Click to expand...
Thanks Amboman. Your reply was right in the pocket. Ken
 
Amboman said:
1. I prefer to install the engine into the frame first (front engine bolt through mounts) first, then tilt the engine forward and install the transmission. Much easier if you're doing it by yourself.

2. I find it easiest to install the engine and transmission into a bare frame and build up from there.
This blog I wrote years ago may help:
https://www.thisoldtractor.com/projects_barney_blog_2007-08-07_2007-08-07.html

I don't use any lube on the splines of the clutch hub or flywheel. On the output shaft, driveshaft and rear drive splines I use Wurth SIG3000 which is available from MG Cycle.
Click to expand...

Amboman said:
1. I prefer to install the engine into the frame first (front engine bolt through mounts) first, then tilt the engine forward and install the transmission. Much easier if you're doing it by yourself.

2. I find it easiest to install the engine and transmission into a bare frame and build up from there.
This blog I wrote years ago may help:
https://www.thisoldtractor.com/projects_barney_blog_2007-08-07_2007-08-07.html

I don't use any lube on the splines of the clutch hub or flywheel. On the output shaft, driveshaft and rear drive splines I use Wurth SIG3000 which is available from MG Cycle.
Click to expand...
Looks like you may be my go to guy Charlie, we both have a 1974 Eldo police special. Excellent blog btw. I'll get some profile pics up at some point.
 
Lownslow said:
Looks like you may be my go to guy Charlie, we both have a 1974 Eldo police special. Excellent blog btw. I'll get some profile pics up at some point.
Click to expand...

I'll be coming out your way this June for the MGNOC National Rally in John Day and to visit my brother in Fort Rock. Won't be on any of my Loops though - riding my Cal III FF. The Ambassador in the blog will be coming along with me though, ridden by it's latest caretaker.
 
Amboman said:
I'll be coming out your way this June for the MGNOC National Rally in John Day and to visit my brother in Fort Rock. Won't be on any of my Loops though - riding my Cal III FF. The Ambassador in the blog will be coming along with me though, ridden by it's latest caretaker.
Click to expand...
I was planning on attending that rally, John Day is the best. My main group, the Oregon Trail Chapter of the AMCA will be riding there in September. The MG National would be my first Guzzi related ride. Looking forward to it!!!
 
Older bikes don’t have synthetic friendly oil seals, so it may cause a leak. Heavy SP has film thickness greater than an SAE 75W250, yet low fluid friction like 75W90, LW has film thickness greater than an SAE 75W140, yet low fluid friction like 80W gear oil.
I’ve used it for nearly 30 years.
 
GTM® said:
Older bikes don’t have synthetic friendly oil seals, so it may cause a leak. Heavy SP has film thickness greater than an SAE 75W250, yet low fluid friction like 75W90, LW has film thickness greater than an SAE 75W140, yet low fluid friction like 80W gear oil.
I’ve used it for nearly 30 years.
Click to expand...
I once used a synthetic in a vintage bike with a wet clutch and ruined the clutch plates so I'm cautious about using synthetics in projects that pre-date synthetics. In this case, if the synthetic leaks thru an oil seal, I could revert to a mineral oil. On the other hand, why take a chance?
 
Freebirdbeachbum said:
I once used a synthetic in a vintage bike with a wet clutch and ruined the clutch plates so I'm cautious about using synthetics in projects that pre-date synthetics. In this case, if the synthetic leaks thru an oil seal, I could revert to a mineral oil. On the other hand, why take a chance?
Click to expand...
I used synthetic Mobil 1 in my 73 Eldorado, 76 T3 and all others since with no issues. If a seal does leak, it probably needed to be replaced anyway from age. BTW, gear box and rear drive seal part numbers haven't changed since the 5 speed was used. The only update was a rotational direction seal was added later on as an update for the gearbox output or input seal. Right now I just don't remember which was changed. You can use synthetic oil everywhere since the bike has a dry clutch.
 
If you have replaced all of the oil seals, o-rings, etc. - synthetic will be okay. If not, stick with non-synthetic.
 
I've got the gearbox mated to the motor and in the frame. Considering they sat for 20 years, I decided to check a few things before i got any further. One being the clutch. When I apply as much pressure as I can by hand to the clutch lever on the gearbox, I cant get it to budge. Should I expect to able to move it by hand or are the clutch/pressure plates most likely frozen or stuck together?
 
I wouldn't think you could move the small lever by hand, could you put a short tube on it to give you more leverage? If the plates are stuck its not a difficult job to free them, with the engine out of the frame that is. Wouldn't you want to see the state of the clutch anyway seeing its been 20 years, might need replacing. It would be a real pain if after assembly you found the clutch slipping.
 
Freebirdbeachbum said:
I've got the gearbox mated to the motor and in the frame. Considering they sat for 20 years, I decided to check a few things before i got any further. One being the clutch. When I apply as much pressure as I can by hand to the clutch lever on the gearbox, I cant get it to budge. Should I expect to able to move it by hand or are the clutch/pressure plates most likely frozen or stuck together?
Click to expand...
The bikes of your vintage had the 2mm spline clutch hub and plates. Those tend to go bad at 30 to 40 thousand miles. Before you get it all together I would recommend going with the new 4mm spline system. It is extremely difficult to compress the 8 springs behind the pressure plate by hand. The clutch lever and cable give you the mechanical advantage you need.
 
Kevin.NZ said:
I wouldn't think you could move the small lever by hand, could you put a short tube on it to give you more leverage? If the plates are stuck it’s not a difficult job to free them, with the engine out of the frame that is. Wouldn't you want to see the state of the clutch anyway seeing its been 20 years, might need replacing. It would be a real pain if after assembly you found the clutch slipping.
Click to expand...
Using a short tube for leverage. Why didn’t I think of that? It worked well.

I’ve some evidence the clutch was replaced not long before it was stored and it saw little use in the interim. I put it in gear, turned the motor over, pulled the lever and drive stopped turning so I’m calling it good.

Thanks,

Ken
 
I accidentally noted the original foot peg rubbers are different lengths and measured the pegs themselves. The left side is a few mm longer than the right. This appears to mean there are left and right side rubbers.

I checked eBay and a couple of MG parts vendors and there was no mention of this. I did see that a pair of original rubbers on eBay were different lengths but, on the parts vendor’s sites, there was no mention of a left and right and the reproductions appeared to be the same size.

The “problem” is, when sitting on the bike, the script on the pegs appears to be upside down if you put them on as left and right side specific.

…or I might be imagining all this. IMG 9221
 
On my G-5 at the end of the eighties, the clutch hub gave problems near 55K miles. It led to a very grabby or abrupt engagement.
Made the bike hard to ride. Nice to have a chance to check it before assembly.
The peg rubbers? Could it be front and rear, same side??
 
Freebirdbeachbum said:
I accidentally noted the original foot peg rubbers are different lengths and measured the pegs themselves. The left side is a few mm longer than the right. This appears to mean there are left and right side rubbers.

I checked eBay and a couple of MG parts vendors and there was no mention of this. I did see that a pair of original rubbers on eBay were different lengths but, on the parts vendor’s sites, there was no mention of a left and right and the reproductions appeared to be the same size.

The “problem” is, when sitting on the bike, the script on the pegs appears to be upside down if you put them on as left and right side specific.

…or I might be imagining all this. View attachment 34371
Click to expand...

On all of the peg rubbers I've bought, the script is both "right-side up" and "upside down", 180 degrees rotation from each other. If it doesn't read correctly, rotate it on the peg 180 degrees.

I've never noticed any difference in length, but then I never really looked.
 
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