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2008 Norge...CANbus??
- Thread starter CKC132
- Start date
No it is not a CanBus, but the taillight assembly are LEDS, What do you want to do with the light on the box, running light,Brake light or a combo of both if that is possible on the CooCase ?
kiwi dave
GT Reference
CKC132 said:
You could try paralleling the running and brake light connections with those on the bike, but I suspect you will require an isolating diode at least. Are the LEDs on the Coocase separate for running and brake, or the same LEDs that just get brighter when the brake is applied, as on your Norge?
Brian UK
GT Reference
Well I have an LED brake light on my Givi top box, and that works fine when just patched into the brake light supply on the bike. Standard 12 volts.
AnthonyMartello
Just got it firing!
Hi... Nope thats not a canbus, But, the Coocase IS really nice. The high-end version is even more money but it has lights, a keyless entry system and an alarm. It also has a nice padded liner and is very well made. We'll see how the Bestem holds up, but I'm quite sure the Coocase will be around for a long time to come.
Thanks,
Anthony
Thanks,
Anthony
Brian UK
GT Reference
Those run between the ECU and Dash so will be some sort of comms. There is also the K Line, which also goes to the diagnostic socket.
afulldeck
Cruisin' Guzzisti
- Joined
- Jul 30, 2010
- Messages
- 114
RJVB said:
Yes. That's why I suggested that CAN-l (one line) and Can-H (other line) seem to comprise the Canbus. I always understood that Canbus stood for Controller Area Network and it was the communications path between the ECU and the Dash that accounted for and responded to all of the key inputs (side stand down, clutch switch, engine sensor etc.)
Although I don't know for sure, I would think that makes the Norge Canbus does it not?
That said, it would be a heck of a lot easier to figure these things out if Piaggo gave the complete schematic to the ECU and Dashboard...but since they are currently only white blocks on a page its only a guess....
Mi_ka
High Miler
Canbus is a proprietary protocol by Bosch specifically and successfully designed for the automotive environment.
It is a digital serial protocol cleverly implemented.
Given this, there are dozens of other ways to implement your own digital protocol to make you incompatible and avoid having to pay patent cash to Bosch.
But there is some reasoning for most automotive companies selecting canbus and not going down the way of designing their own digital busses:
a.It works
b.all your subcontractors that make components and usually supply other companies too all share a common digital communication platform so there is no need each time to reinvent the (digital) wheel to design a modern bell & whistles car.
If your 2-3 electronics sub contractors only supply 2-3 more local (italian) companies then no need to go can bus - just design your bus.
It is a great pitty that we miss OBD kind of standardization in the bike world.
I never understood why.
It is a digital serial protocol cleverly implemented.
Given this, there are dozens of other ways to implement your own digital protocol to make you incompatible and avoid having to pay patent cash to Bosch.
But there is some reasoning for most automotive companies selecting canbus and not going down the way of designing their own digital busses:
a.It works
b.all your subcontractors that make components and usually supply other companies too all share a common digital communication platform so there is no need each time to reinvent the (digital) wheel to design a modern bell & whistles car.
If your 2-3 electronics sub contractors only supply 2-3 more local (italian) companies then no need to go can bus - just design your bus.
It is a great pitty that we miss OBD kind of standardization in the bike world.
I never understood why.
Brian UK
GT Reference
EOBD(1 or 2) is likely to become standard on new bikes in Europe, it's being discussed at EU parliamentary level currently.
P
PP-1753
Guest
I have heard a rumour that the bus used is actually called LIN-Bus. This stands for Local Interconnect Network. LIN is actually a subset of CAN (I would imagine in its simplest form). I am doing some research on this right now and will update when I know more...
Mi_ka
High Miler
I'd be really amazed if all cars talked the same CAN protocol! I remember seeing a 20h news item (!) about flaring car repair costs in which a generic workshop owner complained they couldn't do a simple replacement of something like a brake caliper on a recent BMW because of a proprietary CAN issue. It's not like it's difficult to define your own protocol, either. There are nice sides to CAN but I no longer really know what to think when hearing stories like just mentioned, or the hubbub it provokes simply installing a car radio in my gf's car.
As to the Norge: from what I recall, only the communication between the ECU and the dash is multiplexed - sensors still send their traditional analog signals.
As to the Norge: from what I recall, only the communication between the ECU and the dash is multiplexed - sensors still send their traditional analog signals.
Mi_ka
High Miler
Digital Protocols are like onions: In the core layers rest the physical description, the basic electrical characteristics, data pack description, arbitration of data packets-description of node architecture etc. This design standardization between subcontractors mess is instantly resolved up to the ready-to-buy-chips and cabling to manufacture your subsystem according to the commissioned requirements if you go the proven CAN bus way.
Whether this subsystem is and how integrated in the vehicle's system resides in outer "onion layers" describing sent and expected data between nodes which differ according to each company design policy .
So do not expect to fit VW CAN bus parts to BMW cars even if they are the same Bosch parts.
The good thing is that hooking on to CAN bus lines trying to do some reverse engineering to alter things according to your will is fairly documented so you are not probing into entirely uncharted territory.
But this is all the help you can get without manufacturer "sacred book" data usually not found.
So you could fit the VW part to the BMW car but this would need so many man-hours of reverse engineering and extra "piggy-back" designing that it is practically not feasible.
Whether this subsystem is and how integrated in the vehicle's system resides in outer "onion layers" describing sent and expected data between nodes which differ according to each company design policy .
So do not expect to fit VW CAN bus parts to BMW cars even if they are the same Bosch parts.
The good thing is that hooking on to CAN bus lines trying to do some reverse engineering to alter things according to your will is fairly documented so you are not probing into entirely uncharted territory.
But this is all the help you can get without manufacturer "sacred book" data usually not found.
So you could fit the VW part to the BMW car but this would need so many man-hours of reverse engineering and extra "piggy-back" designing that it is practically not feasible.
P
PP-1753
Guest
OK - now it's starting to gel...
A local contact (OK a fellow Guzzisti and now I owe him a few beers) put me onto these items:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/USB-VAG-...tive_Tools&hash=item35b9107192#ht_4099wt_1111 and http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Fiat-3pi...t=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item27c3809aa5 and some software called DucatiDiag.
Now I can talk from my old laptop through USB port, through the first cable, through the second cable which plugs into the ECU connector under the seat - what's more, they seem happy talking amongst themselves - definitely not CAN as CAN requires a CAN-H, a CAN-L as well as a common and is three wires. The resultant LIN interface is a high speed serial link.
When I get the combination on the Oscilloscope and/or/data analyser I will be able to add more.
Total cost of these cables is less than AUD$20.00 - money well spent.
A local contact (OK a fellow Guzzisti and now I owe him a few beers) put me onto these items:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/USB-VAG-...tive_Tools&hash=item35b9107192#ht_4099wt_1111 and http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Fiat-3pi...t=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item27c3809aa5 and some software called DucatiDiag.
Now I can talk from my old laptop through USB port, through the first cable, through the second cable which plugs into the ECU connector under the seat - what's more, they seem happy talking amongst themselves - definitely not CAN as CAN requires a CAN-H, a CAN-L as well as a common and is three wires. The resultant LIN interface is a high speed serial link.
When I get the combination on the Oscilloscope and/or/data analyser I will be able to add more.
Total cost of these cables is less than AUD$20.00 - money well spent.