Another New Norge

[apexal]

I bought a brand-new leftover 2008 Norge a few weeks ago and I've ridden it about 1200 miles so far. My 5 previous and most recent motorcycles are four Ducatis and one Triumph Sprint and prior to that I owned a Lemans IV back in the eighties, so that's what I compare the Norge to.

Anyway, my Norge is far from perfect and I've had quite a few issues with the bike, but for some strange reason I love the thing. It's funny to read on the forums about people writing about how the Norge handles and it's power. This is not a sport bike; I too agree with many that the suspension is weak, but I think that it does a reasonable job for it's intended purpose. And it's no powerhouse. Some people talk about it's torque or revving it for power, but I don't see this bike as a torquer or revver. It seems like I'm shifting an awful lot for such a big engine but thank goodness for such a nice, easy shifting gear box. But once again, for it's intended purpose it has reasonable power. I do love the sound of the engine, the way it idles, the way that it pulses at speed, the gear noise and the patter of the exhaust on deceleration. On the Norge I find myself riding a bit slower than my pervious bikes and actually enjoying the "slower" pace. I'm even stopping more and enjoying just being out there in the world. I think that it's called smelling the roses!

I still own my Ducati 900SS and Triumph Sprint ST but haven't used either since I bought the Guzzi. Maybe there's a reason that I never stopped thinking about Moto Guzzi in the twenty plus years since I sold my Lemans. I'll never part with my 900SS but maybe they'll take a Triumph in trade for a Griso?

 

[draidt]

At 1200 miles you are along way from realizing how the 1200 2V motor can and will perform when it get's broken in. Since your only previous Guzzi experience was a LeMans IV you are probably lugging the motor without realizing it. The FI 1200 motor thrives at over 3500 RPMs. Ive done over a 200 mile stretch on the BRP in 2nd gear and occasionally 3rd gear your Norge will love you for it.

 

[Nick]

I don't know anyone that said the Norge is a powerhouse or a sport bike, (and I actually feel that the soft "suspension" thing is a bit overplayed). However it's a very nice sport tourer and, when pushed, it will keep-up with most Sports Tourers in the twisties.
I just came back from an 1,800 miles week end in those beautiful roads of West Virginia and the Norge performed brilliantly.
Mine is happiest between 4500 and 6500 rpms.
Good luck with yours.

 

[apexal]

I've read on the MG forums from people reporting that the Norge doesn't have good ground clearance and that they drag parts such as the center stand and panniers. Either they're expecting too much from their bike or they're just trying to impress us with their riding skills. I still say that the Norge is not a sport bike, it's a sport tourer.

I've also read on the MG forums from people reporting great power and torque in the Norges. To tell the truth I was kind of shocked at the lack of power in my Norge on my first ride. And it's not about lugging and revving. The Triumph Sprint sitting in my garage is 100 pounds lighter and has 30 more horsepower. Before the Triumph I had a Ducati S4RS, 200 pounds lighter than the Norge with 130 HP at the rear wheel (on a dyno). But I did not buy the Norge for the power and handling. I bought it because I liked it.

 

[Bill Hagan]

I've read on the MG forums from people reporting that the Norge doesn't have good ground clearance and that they drag parts such as the center stand and panniers. Either they're expecting too much from their bike or they're just trying to impress us with their riding skills. I still say that the Norge is not a sport bike, it's a sport tourer.

I've also read on the MG forums from people reporting great power and torque in the Norges. To tell the truth I was kind of shocked at the lack of power in my Norge on my first ride. And it's not about lugging and revving. The Triumph Sprint sitting in my garage is 100 pounds lighter and has 30 more horsepower. Before the Triumph I had a Ducati S4RS, 200 pounds lighter than the Norge with 130 HP at the rear wheel (on a dyno). But I did not buy the Norge for the power and handling. I bought it because I liked it.

Congrats on the new Norge. Hope you have many happy miles on it.

But, with respect to your suspension comments, the trouble with you and Nick is that you are both fit, and some of us are ... ahem ... fat!

I could give a rodent's rear-most orifice about impressing anyone, as, in addition to corpulence, I am too old to worry about what others think ... except Kathi. That said, I do not think that it is asking too much of the Norge not to scrape hard parts when riding two-up, within GVWR limitations, on well-paved roads at typical m/c touring speeds and lean angles. I know what the Norge is ... and isn't. I also know that before I up-gunned the suspension, the Norge provided me with frequent close and disconcerting encounters with road surfaces. Now, nada. YMMV, but do as you please. I would.

 

[guzzibob]

I agree with Bill, as it comes the Norge is way too easy to scrape way too hard. Compared to some of my friends, I really don't ride that hard, & don't weigh that much (165-170), & never carry a passenger. Still, on a twisty road-& I have plenty of them nearby here in LA-way too easy. You can make it a lot better just by cutting back the rubber center stand stop to oh, 1/8" or so, raising the pipe when not using the bags for a while, & jacking up the rear preload & damping, & maybe change the oil up front, but even then it's kinda vague & pillowy until you do the guzzitech (or other) F&R upgrades-which I think are almost mandatory if you are big &/or ride two up, unless you live in the flatlands & like the Cadillac like ride. I don't on both counts. Still it's easy to fix, & at about $1k for front & rear combined, makes such a huge improvement that I don't mind the cost-esp since pretty much no one pays list for these anyway, & esp as compared to what you will pay for a BMW.

 

[Nick]

I don't think you can compare the Triumph Sprint with the Norge just on power alone. Hell, the ST is a 3 cylinder water cooled with over 30 HP more than the Guzzi, IT BETTER spank it on straight roads, but on twisties the Norge holds her own.
And yes, I have tried to lighten up my centerstand by scraping it on the asphalt, but some of those instances were my own fault for "forcing the issue".
On most weekends I ride with my two Philly buddies, one with a 2002 BMW K1200RS and the other with a 2008 Sprint ST, and I'm not the least disadvantaged with the Norge.
Now, when the BMW guy brings out his Ducati 900 SS (FBF made it a 1080) and the Triumph guy brings out his Tuono, I take my own Tuono....and go blasting thru twisties. :twisted:
No, not in Jersey, we don't have any stinkin' twisties!

BTW Bill, they don't call you Valentino Rossi for no reason!

 

[apexal]

I must be slow but I will definitely consider the suspension and clearance mods. For information I weigh 170 pounds, don't carry a passenger, and tend to ride curvy, hilly roads in the mountain areas of New Hampshire. I think that my Sprint is a much better handling bike than the Norge so if I can make the MG at least equal then I would be very pleased. Thanks for the feedback!

And about the power: To be truthful my Norge is running way better since the first service and since I've been adding miles to the odometer. I went for a good ride last night and I have to admit that it actually feels a bit peppy now. Maybe I've been living with my first impression of the power of this bike.

 

[Chuck in Indiana]

The Norge wasn't designed to "go fast". It was designed as a *comfortable* sports TOURER. It eats miles in comfort. Period. Out in the midwest, with its straight roads, moderate curves, etc. I can't imagine a better sports tourer.
Now. As delivered, the suspension is too soft for sporty riding. It starts wallowing, and will ground out on the center stand when pushed. You can turn up the compression and damping, and crank up the preload on the rear spring. Some have gone to 15 wt in the front forks. Trim down the rubber bumper on the center stand.That'll make it tolerable.
Want to make it a SPORTS tourer? Talk to Todd, spend about 1 large, and you're good to go. You'll still have far less in it than the competition, and you get to enjoy that great Guzzi engine. It has *plenty* of power to go fast in the twistys..

 

[misterg]

Thought I'd weigh in on the norge handling issue. I also purchased an '08 (also Black) this year, from Razee motorcycles in R.I., and also do quite a bit of riding in southern NH. Had a serious pucker-up moment on a NH 137 left-hander on my first weekend out on the thing when the center stand grounded out despite the cut-down bumper trick (no wheel liftage, however). I have since found that with the rear preload set at seven clicks from max and rear damping at 11 clicks out, I can get her over pretty damn far without any grinding (wanker strips are history). I weigh about 178 nekkid, and ride moderately aggressively, primarily in the corners ; ) I agree that the front end could probably use heavier weight oil, but in general I have to say that I am fairly impressed with the Marzocchi fork. It's too bad that the factory specs such an absurdly soft setting for the rear spring, much bad press could have been averted by a few clicks of the adjuster wheel...

I too am coming off a Ducati 900SS ('93 original owner), and find myself enjoying the more leisurely pace that the Norge encourages. Lots more room for gear and for the wife when she's along, not to mention the seriously enhanced comfort for my 47 year old frame... I find that I have to shift my weight around a bit more to get the Norge to follow my lead, but she always seems willing, and in fact turns in MUCH more easily than my SS does ( I also kept my SS, as I also kept, and still have, my '86 Lario from when I bought the SS-- are we detecting a pattern, here?)...

I tend to ride with friends on an FJR1300 and V-Strom 1000 and have no difficulty running with these vastly more "powerful" machines. The Guzzi's solid midrange power and responsiveness gives me all I need to hang in, and the handling is very confidence inspiring, once you are certain that the stand won't grind if you go in too hot.

Love the Norge, and am sure you will too. Melting headlight problem, not so much.

 

[apexal]

I do love my Norge. As far as my Triumph goes, I took it out last weekend for the first time since I bought the Norge. The Triumph flat out rides and handles better than the Norge and has WAY more power to boot. But I don't like the Triumph. In fact, now I'm thinking about getting another new Guzzi! I've fallen in love with a new, shiny red Griso on my dealer's showroom floor. They gave me a decent offer on my Triumph Sprint towards the Griso and will actually let me take a test ride on it. So what's the chance of me riding that thing and not buying it?

 

[GTM®]

I do love my Norge. They gave me a decent offer on my Triumph Sprint towards the Griso and will actually let me take a test ride on it. So what's the chance of me riding that thing and not buying it?

1100 or 1200? Either way, it'll be tough to walk, especially if the price is good.

 

[apexal]

1100 or 1200? Either way, it'll be tough to walk, especially if the price is good.

It's a 2010 1200 8V. The price is list but they're offering a good trade for the Triumph. I haven't liked the Triumph since the day that I bought it and want to get rid of it real bad. Here's an opportunity. I traded a Ducati Monster S4RS towards the Triumph. The S4RS was one of the best bikes that I ever owned and I miss it. I'm hoping that the Griso will be a Guzzi version of the Monster.....great engine, awesome brakes, good handling and a blast to ride!

 

[apexal]

The S4RS was one of the best bikes that I ever owned and I miss it. I'm hoping that the Griso will be a Guzzi version of the Monster.....great engine, awesome brakes, good handling and a blast to ride!

Well, I took the Griso for a nice test ride and definitely compared it against the S4RS. Without a doubt the S4RS has a lot more power, better brakes, suspension and handling. But the Griso isn't exactly a slouch! The Griso is a bit more comfortable, is way more stable, has gobs of personality, has an awesome motor and gets a ton of cool points! Did I mention how much fun it was? I guess that it's no suprise that I put a deposit on the Griso!

 

[GTM®]

I guess that it's no suprise that I put a deposit on the Griso!

It's not. Congrats! What it lacks in power can be had with the basics... air box revisions, slip-on muffler and fueling revision. It becomes a beast with these mods. Post again soon.

 

[apexal]

I guess that it's no suprise that I put a deposit on the Griso!

... air box revisions, slip-on muffler and fueling revision. It becomes a beast with these mods.

I'm assuming that info on these mods are on this forum? To be honest I find it hard to search and find info and topics on this or any forum. I suppose that if I really want to find something then I can and will! But tell me, do I loose any bottom end with the mods? I love power but I'd probalby rather have some low end and drivability than outright power.

 

[jdgretz]

I'm a big fan of Todds' recommended suspension upgrades. My Norge (an '07) was mushy and vague in the corners, and on occasion downright scary, and I'm not that aggressive a rider, as Todd can tell you. After the suspension upgrade the bike feels much more planted under all conditions. The front end "dive" is gone, it's no longer vague in the corners and inspires confidence. I'm definitely the week point in the equation now. The other thing that made a big difference was a move from Metzlers to Dunlop Road Smarts. Make those changes and it's like a completely different motorcycle.

jdg

 

[guzzibob]

I guess that it's no suprise that I put a deposit on the Griso!

... air box revisions, slip-on muffler and fueling revision. It becomes a beast with these mods.

I'm assuming that info on these mods are on this forum? To be honest I find it hard to search and find info and topics on this or any forum. I suppose that if I really want to find something then I can and will! But tell me, do I loose any bottom end with the mods? I love power but I'd probalby rather have some low end and drivability than outright power.

Yes, the info is here, under Chat & Tech info-not the CARC, etc sub forums, but the first 2 sticky's below that re GT-RX ECU and Mod PC-V & Autotune. And unlike standard hop ups like more aggressive cams, bigger valves, etc, there is no performance cost low end or anywhere. Rather, by correcting the air/fuel mixture to what it should be rather than the insanely lean way it comes, you get very obvious rideability and performance gains everywhere, top to bottom-plus the thing runs noticeably cooler as well. Check out the threads I've mentioned above, you'll see lots of positive comments from very satisfied Guzzisti. I also second JD's comments about the benefits of the suspension upgrades, specifically Hyperpro springs & valve emulators up front & HP shock out back. Made my Norge feel much more stable & planted, without any appreciable downgrade in long distance comfort. Though personally I prefer Michelin Pilot Road 2's over Roadsmarts for the much greater tire life.

 

[jdgretz]

I also second JD's comments about the benefits of the suspension upgrades, specifically Hyperpro springs & valve emulators up front & HP shock out back. Made my Norge feel much more stable & planted, without any appreciable downgrade in long distance comfort. Though personally I prefer Michelin Pilot Road 2's over Roadsmarts for the much greater tire life.

You know, one of these days you just might talk me into trying those Michelins, but I just got a new set of Road Smarts this week, so I'm OK for another 7,000 miles

jdg

 

[apexal]

Yes, the info is here, under Chat & Tech info-not the CARC, etc sub forums, but the first 2 sticky's below that re GT-RX ECU and Mod PC-V & Autotune. And unlike standard hop ups like more aggressive cams, bigger valves, etc, there is no performance cost low end or anywhere. Rather, by correcting the air/fuel mixture to what it should be rather than the insanely lean way it comes, you get very obvious rideability and performance gains everywhere, top to bottom-plus the thing runs noticeably cooler as well. Check out the threads I've mentioned above, you'll see lots of positive comments from very satisfied Guzzisti. I also second JD's comments about the benefits of the suspension upgrades, specifically Hyperpro springs & valve emulators up front & HP shock out back. Made my Norge feel much more stable & planted, without any appreciable downgrade in long distance comfort.

GB, thanks for the info. I found the first sticky (GT-RX ECU) but not the other one. The first sticky has lots of information and lots of positive comments as you said. But for me there's too much info and I'm scratching my head over all the abbreviations and terms (02/lambda input? sensor offset? Adaptive capabilities of the closed-loop PC-V & AutoTune??). So I'd like to ask if somebody could please send me an Email or PM and explain, in basic terms, what these mods are and how to go about it? Do I install the stuff myself? Do I need to hook up to a computer or is it good to go? I'm not much of a mechanic anymore and used to the Ducati method: buy a Termignoni kit (including airbox mod and ECU), and just let the dealer put it in. Pricy, but simple! And I probably know the answer to this one: Can't a real good MG dealer properly do this work and make these mods? I'd be worried about warranty issues as well as my ability.

I happy with my Norge and intend on keeping my stock muffler but would certainly be open to more power and a better running engine. I'll be getting that 8V Griso in the Spring, absolutely want to get rid of that stock muffler, and once again I'd be open to more power and a better running engine.

The suspension mods sound like the best thing that I can do to my Norge. I still do not see this bike as a sport bike but maybe with the suspension mods that opinion will change a bit?