In response to several requests I am going to try and put my perspective on the PCV and it's benefits or otherwise when installed on the Breva 1100. First some background is required, satisfaction with how a motorcycle performs is a complex subject and changes depending on the perspective of the rider - often from day to day depending on the task at hand and the state of mind of the rider. My/Our life is in turmoil at the moment, both personally, professionaly and recreationaly and over the summer I have completely changed my thinking on why it is that I ride and this in turn has changed the perspective from which I evaluate how a bike should perform. There will be no graphs in this analysis, I am very much a seat of the pants rider... if it feels good, then I would suggest it is good. I am not a trained mechanic, but have a solid grounding in engine theory and maintenance gleaned from some formal training in a past agricultural life and many years crawling around lots of different types of vehicles. Some with tracks, some with six and many with four wheels, and of course quite a few with just two wheels mostly in a pair of overalls under a hot tin shed roof. I have made many mistakes and broken many engine parts over the years though clumsy and inept wrenching, but always I have been of the opinion that if some other bugger can do it then why can't I do it just as well. So it is with that mind set I have always ended up with a engine that was running better than it was before I started, even if it took a few goes to get it there. So this discussion should be read with that background in mind, which can be summarised by the fact that the graph of a dynomometer does not appear anywhere in the dicsussion, and in fact although I understand the physics of what such a graph is revealing, the practical implications are beyond me and more importantly the techniques needed to manipulate the graph to achieve a desired outcome in terms of manipulating the engine performance to achieve a "feel" on the road using the PCV are akin in my book to rocket science and therefore not something that I could ever hope (or desire) to do.
So here it is, The Full Monty fuelling of a B1100 according to Mike.C!
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Why is it that we modify our bikes? Is it to gratify an urge to tinker, is it a desire to make them different from the other bloke's bike down the road, or maybe it is a primal urge to make them go as hard as possible, but What is obvious to any casual observer of motorcycles and their riders is that the reasons for modifying a bike are as diverse as there are riders who ride with them. Whatever the motivation, there are three things IMO that cloud the argument about the value of any addition or alteration to the motorcycle's design as it came from the factory. First and most importantly any modifcation can be seen from different perspectives, a fairing for example might be the perfect design to one owner because it looks the business and adds to the lines of the bike, the same fairing might be scorned by another if it gives inadequate protection even though it looks good. Secondly does the mod increase the owner's enjoyment of the bike, this is a very subjective issue but goes to the heart of why we all ride a particular machine set up in a particular way. Thirdly and more defineable from a technical perspective does it make the bike do the job asked of it any better than before.
And so it is with engine go fast mods. For some it's a way of finding that absolute last bit of possible power so they can beat their mate in the twisties, for others it might be a way of fixing an annoying trait and therefore making the bike more "liveable" for others it is just the satisfaction of knowing that the bike is setup just so and for still others with a techno bent it is the numbers on a dyno graph that measure the result.
For those that have never ridden a B11, the stock engine managment and fuelling is very good. The bike has plenty of useable power at the top end as witnessed by a passing manouver from 100km/hr (the state speed limit) which in no way makes the rider twist the grip and hope for the best, power is immediate and plenty for the real world of the average road rider. Tourque is more than adequate, as it should be from an 1100cc engine in a vehicle weighing little more than a large go kart. Unusually from my observations of other Guzzi riders, I am one of those sedate riders who actually enjoys watching the scenery go by rather than the thrill of how far I can lay the bike over in a corner, and strange as it may seem to some derive very little pleasure from the act of riding, in fact most of the time I am scared witless at what might happen if I run out of skill and need more road than the engineers saw fit to provide! For me it is the feeling of freedom that comes from experiencing new landscapes and places from the seat of a bike that floats my boat, rather than the performance of the bike or the perfect line. So my engine rarely sees the high side of 5000RPM and gear changes are more about smooth road speed and engine management than power to the tyres. I point this out because how the bike is usually ridden will affect the riders perception of an engine fuelling system significantly. The Breva's 1100 engine will happily pull away from 2500-3000RPM in a high gear without complaint. The popping and farting observed by Norge and Grisso owners when closing the throttle abruptly (more correctly termed "a trailing throttle") is not an issue, it does it occasionally but it is certainly not a trait that would cause me to wonder about the technical capability of the design team at the factory.
However, there is no doubt in my mind that at higher ambient temperatures (over about 30 degrees C) the engine does not seem as happy especially at idle and the heat on my lower legs from the engine is annoying under these conditions. The bike does not like lower octane fuel very much, Oz high octane is generally advertised as 98RON and is very high quality with mostly AFAIK no added ethanol and when supplied with this elixir the engine never exhibits octane related pinking or detonation, but in many places even short distances from a major town 98 fuel is just not available. In country areas Lower octane fuels are more universal as is the case the world over with 91RON being more the norm although sometimes 95RON is labeled as high octane at the pump, and then of course there is the ever present unknown percentaage of ethanol in lower octane fuels. And although I have said that outright power is not my raison d'être I do think that given that it has an 1100cc engine which after all is as much as that installed in some smaller cars, there is a potential for significant additional power to be had. How much that additional power changes my satisfaction rating of the bike remains to be seen.
Which brings me to my motivation for installing the Full Monty fuelling solution onto my Breva 1100, which must form the basis for any discussion of the outcome of a complicated mod such as this.
More later.....
So why install the full monty system.... Well why indeed now that is a question that I have been trying to answer for the last week or so. I suppose the most honest answer is to say "because I could", but that would be a cop out and not advance the discussion. The problem is that as I said before I have changed my thinking on why I ride and so as a result my original motivation to fork out what is a big chunk of money and perform significant surgery on the bike's brain is now somewhat clouded. But to give us a starting point let's summarize the purpose as follows:
1) I am a sucker for a gadget - and the Full Monty PCV surely has to be considered right up there as the mother of all Guzzi gadgets! But seriously motorcycles are (for me anyway) a hobby, so surely working on the bike is as much a part of the hobby as riding, and therefore qualifies as a legitimate reason for the surgery.
2) I wanted to use it as a proving ground for the intended future install of the same system on a Stelvio to be used as a long distance overland travel machine. In particular could the system be used to allow the use of lower octane fuel.
3) If as has been suggested ad infinitum on this forum the bike is tuned very lean to achieve Euro III emission standards and therfore runs very hot, will altering the mixture provide cooler running? I have had my headers ceramic coated and they run so hot that near the engine the ceramic coating is having trouble coping, so maybe a better and cooler running engine will alleviate this problem with the secondary effect of creating less heat on my legs. I also wonder about how constantly running an engine leaner than is necessary for best tune may effect the longevity of some engine components - in particular the valve seats and to a lesser extent the rings and cylinder bore.
Problem is if I am completly honest, there I run out of reasons..... which is quite embarassing, but it's the truth - makes me wonder if it was actually ever justified, Shhhh better not speak too loudly The Minister might hear - but too be honest again I think she is onto me already. However, never mind we are here to talk about the full monty so we should have a few more things to make a full monty discussion, so to to give us more of a grounding I think it is reasonable to belatedly add the following;
4) The bike should be able to give more grunt - after all it's an 1100cc engine. So given that Todd promises more grunt is to be had, then let's see how much and what a difference it makes
5) Will re-mapping the fuelling make the engine run more smoothly, produce power more evenly than it does now, and will the idle be better than stock
6) and lastly will all vestiages of the dreaded popping on a trailing throttle be banished to the draw of long since forgotten unwanted quirks of the Guzzi mark?
In the next installment we'll check out the how.
So here it is, The Full Monty fuelling of a B1100 according to Mike.C!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why is it that we modify our bikes? Is it to gratify an urge to tinker, is it a desire to make them different from the other bloke's bike down the road, or maybe it is a primal urge to make them go as hard as possible, but What is obvious to any casual observer of motorcycles and their riders is that the reasons for modifying a bike are as diverse as there are riders who ride with them. Whatever the motivation, there are three things IMO that cloud the argument about the value of any addition or alteration to the motorcycle's design as it came from the factory. First and most importantly any modifcation can be seen from different perspectives, a fairing for example might be the perfect design to one owner because it looks the business and adds to the lines of the bike, the same fairing might be scorned by another if it gives inadequate protection even though it looks good. Secondly does the mod increase the owner's enjoyment of the bike, this is a very subjective issue but goes to the heart of why we all ride a particular machine set up in a particular way. Thirdly and more defineable from a technical perspective does it make the bike do the job asked of it any better than before.
And so it is with engine go fast mods. For some it's a way of finding that absolute last bit of possible power so they can beat their mate in the twisties, for others it might be a way of fixing an annoying trait and therefore making the bike more "liveable" for others it is just the satisfaction of knowing that the bike is setup just so and for still others with a techno bent it is the numbers on a dyno graph that measure the result.
For those that have never ridden a B11, the stock engine managment and fuelling is very good. The bike has plenty of useable power at the top end as witnessed by a passing manouver from 100km/hr (the state speed limit) which in no way makes the rider twist the grip and hope for the best, power is immediate and plenty for the real world of the average road rider. Tourque is more than adequate, as it should be from an 1100cc engine in a vehicle weighing little more than a large go kart. Unusually from my observations of other Guzzi riders, I am one of those sedate riders who actually enjoys watching the scenery go by rather than the thrill of how far I can lay the bike over in a corner, and strange as it may seem to some derive very little pleasure from the act of riding, in fact most of the time I am scared witless at what might happen if I run out of skill and need more road than the engineers saw fit to provide! For me it is the feeling of freedom that comes from experiencing new landscapes and places from the seat of a bike that floats my boat, rather than the performance of the bike or the perfect line. So my engine rarely sees the high side of 5000RPM and gear changes are more about smooth road speed and engine management than power to the tyres. I point this out because how the bike is usually ridden will affect the riders perception of an engine fuelling system significantly. The Breva's 1100 engine will happily pull away from 2500-3000RPM in a high gear without complaint. The popping and farting observed by Norge and Grisso owners when closing the throttle abruptly (more correctly termed "a trailing throttle") is not an issue, it does it occasionally but it is certainly not a trait that would cause me to wonder about the technical capability of the design team at the factory.
However, there is no doubt in my mind that at higher ambient temperatures (over about 30 degrees C) the engine does not seem as happy especially at idle and the heat on my lower legs from the engine is annoying under these conditions. The bike does not like lower octane fuel very much, Oz high octane is generally advertised as 98RON and is very high quality with mostly AFAIK no added ethanol and when supplied with this elixir the engine never exhibits octane related pinking or detonation, but in many places even short distances from a major town 98 fuel is just not available. In country areas Lower octane fuels are more universal as is the case the world over with 91RON being more the norm although sometimes 95RON is labeled as high octane at the pump, and then of course there is the ever present unknown percentaage of ethanol in lower octane fuels. And although I have said that outright power is not my raison d'être I do think that given that it has an 1100cc engine which after all is as much as that installed in some smaller cars, there is a potential for significant additional power to be had. How much that additional power changes my satisfaction rating of the bike remains to be seen.
Which brings me to my motivation for installing the Full Monty fuelling solution onto my Breva 1100, which must form the basis for any discussion of the outcome of a complicated mod such as this.
More later.....
So why install the full monty system.... Well why indeed now that is a question that I have been trying to answer for the last week or so. I suppose the most honest answer is to say "because I could", but that would be a cop out and not advance the discussion. The problem is that as I said before I have changed my thinking on why I ride and so as a result my original motivation to fork out what is a big chunk of money and perform significant surgery on the bike's brain is now somewhat clouded. But to give us a starting point let's summarize the purpose as follows:
1) I am a sucker for a gadget - and the Full Monty PCV surely has to be considered right up there as the mother of all Guzzi gadgets! But seriously motorcycles are (for me anyway) a hobby, so surely working on the bike is as much a part of the hobby as riding, and therefore qualifies as a legitimate reason for the surgery.
2) I wanted to use it as a proving ground for the intended future install of the same system on a Stelvio to be used as a long distance overland travel machine. In particular could the system be used to allow the use of lower octane fuel.
3) If as has been suggested ad infinitum on this forum the bike is tuned very lean to achieve Euro III emission standards and therfore runs very hot, will altering the mixture provide cooler running? I have had my headers ceramic coated and they run so hot that near the engine the ceramic coating is having trouble coping, so maybe a better and cooler running engine will alleviate this problem with the secondary effect of creating less heat on my legs. I also wonder about how constantly running an engine leaner than is necessary for best tune may effect the longevity of some engine components - in particular the valve seats and to a lesser extent the rings and cylinder bore.
Problem is if I am completly honest, there I run out of reasons..... which is quite embarassing, but it's the truth - makes me wonder if it was actually ever justified, Shhhh better not speak too loudly The Minister might hear - but too be honest again I think she is onto me already. However, never mind we are here to talk about the full monty so we should have a few more things to make a full monty discussion, so to to give us more of a grounding I think it is reasonable to belatedly add the following;
4) The bike should be able to give more grunt - after all it's an 1100cc engine. So given that Todd promises more grunt is to be had, then let's see how much and what a difference it makes
5) Will re-mapping the fuelling make the engine run more smoothly, produce power more evenly than it does now, and will the idle be better than stock
6) and lastly will all vestiages of the dreaded popping on a trailing throttle be banished to the draw of long since forgotten unwanted quirks of the Guzzi mark?
In the next installment we'll check out the how.
