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California Max. Speed
- Thread starter JMVintage
- Start date
Penis Rotor
GT Godfather!
Any of the Calis, never mind a bagged up Vintage are designed as a fairly sedate tourer with the frame of a 1970's 'Sports' bike, when "sports' meant a much different thing than it does nowadays.
The original 'Short Head' frame was designed for great rigidity and a compact form. In the 1980's Guzzi foolishly 'en-biggened' the frame, mainly to appeal to a new type of rider who felt that their *BIG* 1,000cc, (Actually 948!) had to be BIG! Presumably because the amount of hormones and steroids they were getting in their food was making their willies shrink, or not....
By the time the late model Calis which all share an essentially un-changed frame came along in the mid '90's it was accepted that the factory bike was now a softly sprung 'Touring' sled.
Take the un-neccessary munt off 'em and sort the suspension and you can still have a bike that will hold its own with most other similar bikes and many that are on paper far superior.
Thing is though it is still an OLD and badly modified OLD design that has got away from what it was originally and can no longer expect to match other machines with a more specific design focus.
How often do you ride heavily bagged up at 100MPH plus? If your answer is 'Often' then I cordially suggest you buy a Norge or an 8V Griso and put a screen on it, (mine feels horribly nice at 100MPH+. WITH LUGGAGE!) If though you like the character of the Calvin then stick to it, but accept that top end handling is NOT going to be its forte, especially with bags and a great big sail on the front!
Having said that my Mate Steve managed to cover some serious distance in an frighteningly short time on his bagged up EVT last month. Out west on the way to Broken Hill he was averaging 95MPH!!!! All straight and flat though!!!!
Pete
The original 'Short Head' frame was designed for great rigidity and a compact form. In the 1980's Guzzi foolishly 'en-biggened' the frame, mainly to appeal to a new type of rider who felt that their *BIG* 1,000cc, (Actually 948!) had to be BIG! Presumably because the amount of hormones and steroids they were getting in their food was making their willies shrink, or not....
By the time the late model Calis which all share an essentially un-changed frame came along in the mid '90's it was accepted that the factory bike was now a softly sprung 'Touring' sled.
Take the un-neccessary munt off 'em and sort the suspension and you can still have a bike that will hold its own with most other similar bikes and many that are on paper far superior.
Thing is though it is still an OLD and badly modified OLD design that has got away from what it was originally and can no longer expect to match other machines with a more specific design focus.
How often do you ride heavily bagged up at 100MPH plus? If your answer is 'Often' then I cordially suggest you buy a Norge or an 8V Griso and put a screen on it, (mine feels horribly nice at 100MPH+. WITH LUGGAGE!) If though you like the character of the Calvin then stick to it, but accept that top end handling is NOT going to be its forte, especially with bags and a great big sail on the front!
Having said that my Mate Steve managed to cover some serious distance in an frighteningly short time on his bagged up EVT last month. Out west on the way to Broken Hill he was averaging 95MPH!!!! All straight and flat though!!!!
Pete
JMVintage
Just got it firing!
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2009
- Messages
- 18
Thanks Pete!
Actually 150Km/h max. is more than enough for me. I normally cruise at around 130Km/h (81 MPH). I was just trying to check how fast I could ride it in comfort.
I'm not looking for any faster bike. My previous one was a 2008 Triumph Sprint ST on which I could ride at 200 Km/h all day long. But that is not very advisable for my longevity when I'm already reaching 60 years of age
Actually 150Km/h max. is more than enough for me. I normally cruise at around 130Km/h (81 MPH). I was just trying to check how fast I could ride it in comfort.
I'm not looking for any faster bike. My previous one was a 2008 Triumph Sprint ST on which I could ride at 200 Km/h all day long. But that is not very advisable for my longevity when I'm already reaching 60 years of age
Penis Rotor
GT Godfather!
More than fair. I sometimes scare meself when I realize what speed I'm doing on the Griso in 'Cruise' mode 
. To be honest I try to keep to 130PH, (National limit is 100 on anything other than freeways where it is 110.) but the big G doesn't seem happy under about 5.2. Perhaps I should take a couple of pegs out of the selector drum!
Any of the later Calis are FINE touring bikes and blokes like my mate Steve want nothing more unless it can be made more comfortable for his passenger. He knocked back a Ballagio, although he loved it, because the pillion perch was awful and luggage was practically non existant. The EVT eats miles, has the BEST wheels, adequate suspension for touring duties and it works. He's got 3 other Tonti's and his next purchase will probably be a Bellagio or a 2nd hand spiney but for now his Tonti's work just great. Nothing wrong with that.
Pete
. To be honest I try to keep to 130PH, (National limit is 100 on anything other than freeways where it is 110.) but the big G doesn't seem happy under about 5.2. Perhaps I should take a couple of pegs out of the selector drum!Any of the later Calis are FINE touring bikes and blokes like my mate Steve want nothing more unless it can be made more comfortable for his passenger. He knocked back a Ballagio, although he loved it, because the pillion perch was awful and luggage was practically non existant. The EVT eats miles, has the BEST wheels, adequate suspension for touring duties and it works. He's got 3 other Tonti's and his next purchase will probably be a Bellagio or a 2nd hand spiney but for now his Tonti's work just great. Nothing wrong with that.
Pete
guzzibob
GT Reference
What a shame. My T3FB with large soft bags & barn door windscreen (Plexistar) and nothing more updated suspension wise than Ikon shocks (really a design contemporary to the bikes, but way better than stock) & stiffer OEM springs & screen door type dampeners is perfectly stable at any speed it is capable of (indicated 120 MPH on a good day, probably more like a real 105-110 tops) as long as the tires aren't badly worn. Know several (like Rich R) who have resuspended their bagged Guzzi cruisers, like EV-T, Cal SS et all, to do likewise & better without much drama or fuss. All of them are much better than most other "cruisers" on canyon roads.
I know a thing or two about making the newer Calis work well.
JM, newer Tontis are sensitive to tires and suspension... however, you can make it better by sliding the forks up in the triple trees 1/2~3/4" (15~20mm), hence reducing the rake. A smaller tire profile, i.e. 110/80-17 (used to be Dunlop D205 was the pick, but have since dried up) helps tremendously as well.
All of the Calis come sorely under-sprung; .7kg springs front and rear (good to @155 lbs of weight). Replacing the fork springs and shocks will help greatly. Also body positioning/grip on the bars tends to play as role as well. Sit forward on the nose of the seat and relax on the bars.
My stock-ish Jackal with the OEM Sport screen would sit at 120 indicated all day with nary a wiggle. Rich R's EV with large screen will do nearly the same. Both have suspension and tire replacements outlined above.
I think radar tested newer Calis are near a true 120 (118 from memory), so you can get the speedo to read 130+ if you have enough real estate to do so.
See the main page under Store for recommendations for suspension upgrades, or ping me PM or direct e-mail with any questions; Todd at GuzziTech.com
I'll be moving/moved this to the Tonti section following your reply.
JM, newer Tontis are sensitive to tires and suspension... however, you can make it better by sliding the forks up in the triple trees 1/2~3/4" (15~20mm), hence reducing the rake. A smaller tire profile, i.e. 110/80-17 (used to be Dunlop D205 was the pick, but have since dried up) helps tremendously as well.
All of the Calis come sorely under-sprung; .7kg springs front and rear (good to @155 lbs of weight). Replacing the fork springs and shocks will help greatly. Also body positioning/grip on the bars tends to play as role as well. Sit forward on the nose of the seat and relax on the bars.
My stock-ish Jackal with the OEM Sport screen would sit at 120 indicated all day with nary a wiggle. Rich R's EV with large screen will do nearly the same. Both have suspension and tire replacements outlined above.
I think radar tested newer Calis are near a true 120 (118 from memory), so you can get the speedo to read 130+ if you have enough real estate to do so.
See the main page under Store for recommendations for suspension upgrades, or ping me PM or direct e-mail with any questions; Todd at GuzziTech.com
I'll be moving/moved this to the Tonti section following your reply.
JMVintage
Just got it firing!
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2009
- Messages
- 18
Thank you for your quick answer and help, Todd.
Actually I think that the problem with my California Vintage is not a big one. At low speed I do feel a bit of wobbling on irregular surfaces but nothing dramatic or that I cannot live with. The bike is brand-new therefore I don't think that the mentioned solutions would help. The BIG problem is at high speed and that is easily solved by just not going there.
I
Actually I think that the problem with my California Vintage is not a big one. At low speed I do feel a bit of wobbling on irregular surfaces but nothing dramatic or that I cannot live with. The bike is brand-new therefore I don't think that the mentioned solutions would help. The BIG problem is at high speed and that is easily solved by just not going there.
I
JM, just telling you how to solve the problem... there is nothing wrong with your Vintage, this is what they'll do unless you resolve it based on above. Body positioning and a steering damper is your only easy solution, until you invest as above. Who is your local Guzzi expert?
JMVintage
Just got it firing!
- Joined
- Jul 14, 2009
- Messages
- 18
First, largely ingore roper's comments on the newer tonti's, he drives a hair dressers car and really does not have significant mileage on a sorted newer tonti. Many of the socal folks have well sorted tonti's, and they rail in the corners, and at top speed, and are fine for longer distance. I have a B11, a griso, (pete's scura) and my cal SS with wilbur shocks. The front is a bit soft, todds got my setup in his shop. But I can still top it out and be completely stable, and load it up with my wife and bags and take off for a few days. The shocks would be my first investment, then better springing on the front. My cal SS has the sport sheild, but at top speed is more stable than by griso or breva... I've never been able to see how fast Pete's scura is, but its fast and likely stable, whats left of it....
JM, at 200#, set to max everything. You do not have fork spring preload adjustment. The older versions of your rear shocks *used* to have spring preload adjuster c-clips hidden under the chrome shrouds. Not sure if they are still there or not.
I remember being passed by a California on a Belgian highway last summer. A couple, looking none too svelte, luggage and a screen, and they must have been close to 150km/h. As if it were nothing. I tried to keep up with them for a short bit, but with my big topcase and the Skidmarx screen, I decided the local speedlimit (120kph) really was fast enough to be confortable
the bike may be brand new with new parts etc. But they make em to be comfy and work well at speed limit if you want to push that limit...then the stuff Todd states is the solution. Todd has been messing with the new Tonti cali's since 1999 rides them on the racetrack/street...it's his street sportbike or as we here in SoCal call it his "trackbike"
:woohoo: Todd has tried a bunch of parts on his cali think most info is on this site.
I also have cali's an EV11 and Jackal they run quite nice at speed
it required suspension upgrades, tire selection, and handlebar change (EV11) and changed a bunch more on my Jackal because that's my sportbike 
hmy: YMMV
JMVintage wrote:
Actually you don't on the front forks. Only damping adjustment. If the rear shocks are as described in your manual, you have preload and damping (rebound only) on the rear shocks.
Actually you don't on the front forks. Only damping adjustment. If the rear shocks are as described in your manual, you have preload and damping (rebound only) on the rear shocks.
I have the same forks on my EV11...I have changed the fork springs to Wilbers progressive think they are 9.5 to 1.05, I also put 15 wt fork oil on the compression side and 12.5wt on rebound side I have run it 2 clicksout from max and at max (+) the rebound i move around but mostly 5 clicks out from max to max (what Todd said in his post) there is no preload adjustment you would have to make a longer spacer tube or add washers.
you see I have made it stiffer than stock and still not enough...I have run the stock white power shocks, YSS 366, Wilbers piggyback and tried out Ohlins
right now my Jackal has Wilbers piggyback rear shocks and reworked/resprung forks
EV11 has YSS shocks and reworked/resprung forks these changes have helped take the Drama out of riding the bikes at a awift pace.
you see I have made it stiffer than stock and still not enough...I have run the stock white power shocks, YSS 366, Wilbers piggyback and tried out Ohlins
right now my Jackal has Wilbers piggyback rear shocks and reworked/resprung forks
EV11 has YSS shocks and reworked/resprung forks these changes have helped take the Drama out of riding the bikes at a awift pace.