Close call after front brake fade...

[370_racer]

Couple weeks ago I was riding with few friends in smaller mountain/hills in western IL...we were on this fun road leading up to a small ski resort. The road is two-way but really narrow, no center line, and it goes up and down/left and right while steadily climbing overall mountain. We were moving at decent clip but nothing outrageous, so about 5-7 minutes in, I was going down the hill into a right hander, about 90 deg corner which was dropping further more after the turn...got on the brakes but front just felt like it wasn't grabbing as much. Road was dry, no leaves or anything plus two buddies went through already without issue. Instead of trying to lean into it and make it, I straightened the bike quickly in attempt to slow it down more going straight...well, I quickly ended up leaving the road and was headed for the trees down the hill...it was looking to be ugly, but I wasn't about to give up so I leaned the bike, looked up the road and gave it a go...it pulled me out with a slight "thunk".

In the end, I seem to have been super lucky. It all happened in split second, and thinking back, I am not even sure if it was brake fade, or rider fade...where I simply focused straight off the road instead of looking where I want to go, which ironically in the end saved my ass. The thunk I heard left no marks on the bike that I can find, which is probably due to me being on dirt/grass when it happened. If I went off completely, it would be ugly as ground was dropping at steep angle with trees everywhere.

I still consider myself a relative newb on the bike, with about 10-15k miles and 4 years riding. Need to do some track days next year, or at least some advanced riding courses perhaps. Anyways, thought I'd share...be safe out there!

 

[john zibell]

I think you got it correct when you stated "rider fade". I recommend California Superbike School. http://www.superbikeschool.com/ Even if you have to travel a couple days to get to a venue it will be worth it. You won't need "no stinking brakes" after that. You will learn better throttle control and time management.

 

[GTM®]

Based on your writings, it was a little of both. Downhill for 5-6 minutes using the brakes could have induced brake fade on a V7, no doubt. I have some great solutions to fix that if interested.
The second half is classic rider error, which too can be fixed with some training. I'm not a fan of C.S.S., but you can check out Reg Pridmore's school; ClassRides.com

 

[john zibell]

Todd, I beg to disagree. I've done both Pridmore and Califirnia Superbike. Pridmore was a waste of time and money. Basically track time, with him talking during the breaks. Track instructors didn't instruct, they just ride around it seems for their own entertainment, at least that was what it was like for the two CLASS days I did some years ago. With Code's Superbike school, Keith Code actually knows how to teach, you will get a big bang for your buck. Also the track instructors evaluate and coach you during each track session to make sure you are reaching the objectives of that session.

 

[GuzziMoto]

I am also not a fan of Keith Code's. I don't like the way he teaches. And I also prefer Reg Pridmore's school. But that is something that is a matter of preference.
Only thing I know for sure is if time on a race track was a waste of time and money you're doing it wrong. I can ride around a track by myself and learn.
I don't think any riding school or track time is a waste of time. Whether someone prefers one over another is a matter of taste.
Do your research, make your choices, and enjoy.
Brakes can fade and put you outside your comfort zone leading to errors in judgement. Schools, track time, and experience, can expand your comfort zone. That reduces the chances of you making those errors.

 

[M0T0Geezer]

Meanwhile, back to the subject of this thread...

My '04 Breva 750 and I have ridden almost 25,000 miles in the Colorado mountains. Never experienced anything even close to "brake fade" - on either end - including several trips up and down Mt. Evans. Oh yes, the Brev is still using the original OEM brake pads. The brakes are perfectly matched to the weight of machine and rider IMHO.

The last time I can remember brake fade was in 1970, on a 1969 BSA Rocket III - after two hours riding in the rain. Brake fade does not happen very often, at least in my experience (brain fade is another matter).

Assuming you have eliminated the usual things like low brake fluid, air or moisture in the line, etc then the next area of investigation has to be the way you ride.

The Guzzi 750s have a lot of engine braking available. Long and steep downhill stretches need a gear that keeps the engine spinning near 4500 rpm (same for uphill for that matter).

 

[elkgrichard]

The front brake on these V7's need time and miles to bed in and then they work relatively good, never great. First bike I've own with Brembo brakes, expected better performance from Brembo.

 

[ghezzi]

The front brake on these V7's need time and miles to bed in and then they work relatively good, never great. First bike I've own with Brembo brakes, expected better performance from Brembo.

Brembo make some awesome products but you must remember, some models (if not all) are built to a price point. Cali EV has twin Brembo Gold Line 4 spot calipers, bloody good brakes and the standard fair on most Italian motorcycles prior to radials. Meanwhile my Bellagio had 2 spot calipers that were sub standard by my reckoning, big squeeze, moderate power and wooden feel. I swapped them for calipers off a 999R Ducati, not only 4 spot but 4 individual pads. Then a Brembo radial master cylinder really gave it some feel and power. Then I added BrakeTech Axis Iron rotors. One finger braking, now it stops properly!

So if you have a minimum standard that you'll be happy with, whatever it costs is irrelevant, as long as it makes you happy.
I know you're stuck with a single disc, but a caliper/master cylinder upgrade would do wonders.