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Norge handlebar hits tank

B

bteddy

Just got it firing!
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
6
Any ideas on how to fix this? Took my new Norge in for first service and tech did not know how to remedy this problem? When turned fully to the left the grip hits the tank...not good for paint. Tried just filing off some plastic...the more I file, the further it keeps turning, as if there is no stop. Also, there are many references to Mike Bui's risers but no reference on how to get them.

Thanks
 
Try as I might I can't get a good picture of the triple tree stops, they are welded to the head stock, I would get it fixed or resolved before thinking of risers to mask a problem. Don't go to the mechanic go to the owner and demand resolution. It is a DEFINITE safety item. Did Guido forget a weld on the correct location. Do the bars turn to the right as far as they should ???? That will be the clincher for me if they don't.
 
Bike was purchased new from dealer. Turning right stops just short of hitting tank, left goes into tank, and actually seemed to get worse after dealer tech completed first service on bike.
 
Have you checked the stops on the lower fork yoke? The frame stops are unlikely to be wrong or damaged but the fork yoke is alloy and therefore much softer. Here you would not get a road Warrant of Fitness if the 'bars hit anything other than the proper stops.
 
Right on guys! I just checked the frame stop and one side is slightly concave instead of flat. Fix would probably require a re-weld of a new stop, makes me wonder why dealer could not figure this out.
 
bteddy wrote:
Right on guys! I just checked the frame stop and one side is slightly concave instead of flat. Fix would probably require a re-weld of a new stop, makes me wonder why dealer could not figure this out.
Click to expand...

Wow! How could that have been overlooked? Good catch. Stories like these reinforce the work I put in to being self reliant. Please let us know how the dealer and Guzzi resolve this.
 
Here is a pic of the stop on my B - Odds are it will be the same on the Norge.

mikec_brakelines0002.jpg
 
Welding on a frame in that location is risky because heat could deform the steering head bearing seating. When I was building or modifying frames the procedure was to complete the welding without the steering head bearings fitted, precision-grind the bearing seatings, which were always slightly distorted, then fit the bearings. If the bearings are distorted by welding they will forever be a problem and at the very least will wear prematurely.

Electric welding on a complete bike frame is also very risky to electronic components unless the welder is very clued up.

Under no circumstances would I allow a dealer's mechanic to weld anything on a modern bike.

Since yours is a new bike I'd be insisting on a replacement bike. Even having a new frame obtained and fitted would be unacceptable to me - it would take forever and who has a mechanic up to the task anyway? :(
 
GrahamNZ wrote:
Even having a new frame obtained and fitted would be unacceptable to me - it would take forever and who has a mechanic up to the task anyway?
Click to expand...

Here Here to that!
 
Thanks to all for the help. This is a 2007 bought new in Oct. 2008 (still under warranty) I had to walk through glass to get what I wanted at a good price, shipping a great distance etc...now this. This may be a huge uphill battle to solve. After looking at the stop I may be able to trim a little more from the grip to actually allow the stop to work as is. This really isn't much of a safety issue for me, just cosmetic on the tank. You are also correct on the re-welding issue, not a good idea...glad you guys are there to keep me on track. This is the first Guzzi for me and I planned it to be the last bike I buy (retired now and an ex Harley rider) Sure it's got a few quirks and isn't the fastest bike in town, but it got more character than anything on the road. Damn...I just don't want to give this bike back. I'll let you know the outcome

Thanks to all
 
bteddy

If left to my own resources on a deserted island, and owning a Guzzi is a bit like that at times, I'd "innovate". Some thoughts on that which may help:

Something to investigate is the position of the tubular handlebars in the cast risers. While the switchblocks are pegged to the 'bars, the bars themselves can be rotated in the risers by loosening the screws in the 'bar ends. If the 'bars are reluctant to move, with the screws just loosened a few turns give them a smack on the heads with a solft drift and hammer. That may allow you to achieve the clearance you need provided the switches still suit you. The brake and clutch levers can be rotated on the 'bars anyway.

If that doesn't do the trick, maybe this will:

Drill into the front of the stop block on the frame in two places near the ends of the block and using a bottoming tap, thread the holes M6.

Fold up a steel strip into a U shape of appropriate dimensions, drill 6.5mm dia holes to match the holes in the stop block and fix the U-piece to the stop block with M6 set screws. The 'bars on my Breva leave the left switch block 12mm and the right 35mm clear of the tank, so at a guess I'd say the U piece could be 3mm thick. If your bike is OK on one side you could use just an L - piece.

Good luck.
 
Bteddy, the warranty starts from the time of purchse in most countries. Warranty work can be done by any Guzzi dealer, doesn't have to be the one you bought from. But if you intended to reject the bike (if that's an option where you are), then that would have to be done through the supplying dealer.

The problem is, if you start fiddling with it and modifying the frame stop, you may invalidate that warranty, especially if your mod goes wrong.
So get it to your nearest dealer as soon as you can and point out the exact problem, and get them to take it from there.

It's not just a cosmetic issue, if you had the misfortune to drop the bike (even at a very low speed), then the tank could be ruptured by the bars, causing all sorts of potential problems you don't want to even think about, the worst being the whole lot, including you, going up in flames.
 
Well at the risk of hearing yells of heresy and being poo pod'd, here goes. This sounds like a perfect spot to use the tried and true J B Weld (the slow setting type) get a piece of metal thick enough to build the stop to where it should and JB it. This is not a spot of continuous violent contact with anything else save for when the bike is on the side stand and the bars turned all the way to the left. OK in the event of a crash and the bars are violently forced agaist the stop that piece will be wedge in there anyway even if the bond was broken.


MY 2C


yhst-78009401073713_2049_12467323
 
If this was my bike i'd dump it straight back to the dealer and demand a replacement.
I can't believe this wasn't spotted at a PDI
Fair enough, if its an old second hand bike i'd be happy to bodge up a steering stop, but it isn't, its brand new.
I've never ever bought a new bike, but if i did i'd want everything right...
 
draidt wrote:
Well at the risk of hearing yells of heresy and being poo pod'd, here goes. This sounds like a perfect spot to use the tried and true J B Weld (the slow setting type) get a piece of metal thick enough to build the stop to where it should and JB it. This is not a spot of continuous violent contact with anything else save for when the bike is on the side stand and the bars turned all the way to the left. OK in the event of a crash and the bars are violently forced agaist the stop that piece will be wedge in there anyway even if the bond was broken.


MY 2C

I don't think this is "heresy". It might be for the BMW crowd, but not traditionally Guzzi folk. Assuming that the stop is just a hair off, this is really a trivial thing, and either the JB weld fix or Graham's somewhat more complicated one is going to be far less aggravating & time consuming, & just as effective as trying to get a new bike or frame out of Guzzi. Esp since in buying a bike from a far away dealer in order to save the most $ you really set yourself up for this. Come on, who is really this helpless?
Click to expand...
 
What should be and what is are often poles apart. That's when a reality check is needed. bteddy had his own reasons for buying where and how he did and no matter what, he is entitled to full warranty cover. But will taking that medicine be worse than the disease? He has said he isn't confident of being given a new bike so what options does he have? Engage in a long battle which will leave him with the problem while it's fought, and probably lost, or bite the bullet and fix the problem himself. I know what I'd do in his situation and that's what I posted.

Remember my first self-cure suggestion was to investigate if rotating the 'bars and switch blocks would solve the problem. If that draws a blank, only then add a screwed-on metal stop. Faced with a choice between any type of glue and a bolt, I'll take the bolt every time.

Glue always relies on so many factors being perfect for it to work reliably that it's never my first preference. I knew a guy who once glued loose steel-ends back onto alloy pushrods using heat-cured Araldite epoxy. It worked for a while then.........Oh! Bugger!

The famous USA racer Cal Rayborne was killed at Pukekohe Raceway NZ when the polyester filler used to modify the cylinder porting in his 2-stroke racer came adrift, altering the timing and causing the engine to suddenly run lean, sieze and him to crash fatally. Goos can work but they're too often poo.
 
this is not glue in an engine! Gluing a rubber stop onto the frame lug would work but as it's under warranty I'd take it back.
 
A couple more thoughts:

* the tank is actually an outside shell, as far as I know, and made of good quality plastic that wont crack too easily. Even if it does, it's "only" cosmetic. Correct me if I'm wrong...!
* check the handlebar tube. Mine was bent a little during a crash, causing the switchgear to touch my tank protector. In other words, if you know how to bend tubes, you do have some margin there.
* The stops on our motorcycle simulator have been altered in a way that may be useful here. If I'm not mistaken, the ones on the frame have either not been touched OR have been filed off completely, but the ones on the triple tree have been replaced by or have been complemented with a couple of bolts. Locking nuts and washers allow those to be set to the desired length.

bteddy: whom did you buy this bike from, and exactly how far from you is that? Getting the bike exchanged for a "good" one may have to be done through the original vendor, but it's not impossible that the exchange could be arranged or at least planned with the help of another dealer closer to you (you'll need one anyway!). WIth the summer coming up and you being retired, the exchange might be an excuse for an (extended) riding trip?
 
If all else fails, do what I did recently.

I bought some farm equipment which whose motor failed 9 months after purchase (blown rings). I was told it was my fault for poor maintenance (which wasn't true of course). I called the supplier and retailer and told them that I would take an advertisement right next to each of theirs in each magazine they advertise in reporting my consumer feed back of product and customer support.

Guess what? two weeks later a new motor!


You don't need to go to these lengths, just use something like this to get a fair compromise if all else fails - eg get them to pay for bar risers etc to stop the touching.

Keep your spirits up, I believe that those who are right will prosper.


cheers

Robert
 
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