Starter Overheating’76 850 T3

[Lukeduke8150]

Hey guys new on here I have to get some advice on my nightmare I’m dealing with. After $1700 at an MG shop near me had a major tuneup new tires lots of new parts Including an updated fuse box and new wires, electronic ignition, new battery, etc. but every time he fixed one another one would pop up. We stopped at the starter. Running out of cash! He told me just to get it rebuilt because it was overheating and he couldn’t run the bike very long. So after almost 2K invested and the price I paid for the bike it’s pretty disheartening not to be able to ride. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[JasonC]

You need state the year and model of the bike with the starter problem before you can expect to get a response.

Also, not being able to "run the bike very long" and "the starter overheating" are two different problems.

Jason

 

[john zibell]

On the T3 you have a Bosch starter. Any automotive electrical shop can rebuild it. It is a more robust starter than the Valeo used in newer bikes, but it does draw more current to operate. MG cycle has the brushes and solenoids available as well as rebuilt and replacement starters. And yes you can use the Valeo style starter on the T3. Yes the Bosch will get hot when it operates but if it starts the bike you can ride until it either fails, or you fix it. It only draws current when operated.

 

[Lukeduke8150]

The year and model is in the heading of the thread-
76 850 T3

 

[Lukeduke8150]

On the T3 you have a Bosch starter. Any automotive electrical shop can rebuild it. It is a more robust starter than the Valeo used in newer bikes, but it does draw more current to operate. MG cycle has the brushes and solenoids available as well as rebuilt and replacement starters. And yes you can use the Valeo style starter on the T3. Yes the Bosch will get hot when it operates but if it starts the bike you can ride until it either fails, or you fix it. It only draws current when operated.

Great thanks – one more question- should I replace the solenoid as well?

 

[john zibell]

Great thanks – one more question- should I replace the solenoid as well?

Considering the age it might be a good idea. A electric shap may find the bearings in the starter are bad which is a possibility for the heat build up. They are standard bearings and bushings that the shop should be able to source.

 

[Lukeduke8150]

Yeah I dropped it off at a starter shop this morning. I’ll see what’s going on with it. Thanks for the help

 

[Moto-Uno]

For what it's worth I decided to replace my original Bosch starter in my Le Mans 2 ( it's been built up for quite
some time ) with the $100.00 Valeo unit from MG cycle and it works way better than the original ever did . Peter

 

[JasonC]

The year and model is in the heading of the thread-
76 850 T3

Oops, my apologies.

Jason

 

[john zibell]

For what it's worth I decided to replace my original Bosch starter in my Le Mans 2 ( it's been built up for quite
some time ) with the $100.00 Valeo unit from MG cycle and it works way better than the original ever did . Peter

Yes, they work fine until they don't. The Valeo style starter and copies of it work fine until the magnets come loose. I recommend you have a spare ready to go for your bike. I had the Valeo fail on my 1100 Breva with only 30K on the bike. If my wife and I weren't riding together I would have been stranded. 2.5 hour ride home on her bike to get my spare then ride back to put it in. Fortunately I had a very good starter that is no longer in production to put in so I don't anticipate any failure now.

 

[Moto-Uno]

^ Good to know . I still have the original Bosch 1/2 ton brick . It's the Scottish in me , I can't throw anything
out that still works . Now that I have the good fortune of owning 3 Guzzi's , it'll probably out last me if they're
good for 30K or so .

 

[Amboman]

Magnets falling off of Valeos hasn't been an issue for years. Valeo did a redesign and all the "clones" seem to have copied it. I still prefer a Bosch.

 

[john zibell]

Magnets falling off of Valeos hasn't been an issue for years. Valeo did a redesign and all the "clones" seem to have copied it. I still prefer a Bosch.

I guess my 2006 is before the fix. I'm keeping a Bosch in reserve for when the Valeo on my 1990 MkV gives up.

 

[scottmastrocinque]

That broken magnets issue got my 1995 R100GS starter way back about 2006.

They didn’t just come off, they broke into chicklets sized magnetic shards and seized up the entire internals. Frozen solid in place. PITA for sure. (I used to ride extensively off-road on that bike so she got lots of impacts on her bash plate!)

Like Amboman, I too was under the impression that this was rectified by design and manufacturing changes, quite some time ago.

 

[Lukeduke8150]

Yeah I dropped it off at a starter shop this morning. I’ll see what’s going on with it. Thanks for the help

Update- I got my original starter rebuilt and bought and installed a new starter solenoid from MG cycle but now when I try to reinstall my negative battery terminal it sparks and tries to weld itself. I can’t see any wires touching or grounding from the battery to the starter so I’m not sure what’s up.

 

[Moto-Uno]

Remove the +ve lead at the solenoid and try reconnecting the -ve at the batt .
If it stops sparking , there would appear to be something wrong with the solenoid or starter.
Next you could remove the lead from the solenoid to the starter motor , reconnect the +ve
from the battery to the starter and try reconnecting the battery -ve again . No sparking then it pretty much
leads to the starter . Good luck , Peter

 

[john zibell]

Update- I got my original starter rebuilt and bought and installed a new starter solenoid from MG cycle but now when I try to reinstall my negative battery terminal it sparks and tries to weld itself. I can’t see any wires touching or grounding from the battery to the starter so I’m not sure what’s up.

If you aren't touching the the spade terminal on the soleoid this shouldn't happen. If it is arcing then the selenoid may be stuck in the closed position. Remove the solenoid and see if you have continuity from where you attach the cable from the battery to ground. If you do the solenoid is bad.

 

[Lukeduke8150]

Remove the +ve lead at the solenoid and try reconnecting the -ve at the batt .
If it stops sparking , there would appear to be something wrong with the solenoid or starter.
Next you could remove the lead from the solenoid to the starter motor , reconnect the +ve
from the battery to the starter and try reconnecting the battery -ve again . No sparking then it pretty much
leads to the starter . Good luck , Peter

Thanks been busy at work I’m gonna get around to it in the morning.

 

[Lukeduke8150]

If you aren't touching the the spade terminal on the soleoid this shouldn't happen. If it is arcing then the selenoid may be stuck in the closed position. Remove the solenoid and see if you have continuity from where you attach the cable from the battery to ground. If you do the solenoid is bad.

I replaced the solenoid after I got the starter rebuilt with one that I bought from MG cycle. I was just curious there’s two spade connectors on the solenoid and I only have one spade terminal wire coming from the start button. I’ll take it off and try your suggestion in the morning. Thanks

 

[john zibell]

I replaced the solenoid after I got the starter rebuilt with one that I bought from MG cycle. I was just curious there’s two spade connectors on the solenoid and I only have one spade terminal wire coming from the start button. I’ll take it off and try your suggestion in the morning. Thanks

I enlarged the picture of the solenoid and it appears both spades go to the same contact point. I guess the second is for best orientation of the wire from the harness. If this isn't correct, please let us know.