Well oil be blowed!

[fatal]

I couldn't believe my ears this morning when I called a local moto Guzzi dealer to enquire about my 12month first service (only having it done by dealer for warranty purposes)
I asked what oil they used for the service and the reply was " we are Putoline dealers, we use their 10/40 semi synthetic in everything" I then asked this chap what oil did Guzzi reccommend for the Stelvio, "erm, not quite sure, we just use 10/40 semi synthetic" When I pointed out the official reccommendation he seemed a bit non plusssed.... not quite sure what to say. I then asked if i could provide my own oil to which he said it was OK. I reluctantly booked in for the service (this was because I was unable to get in touch with my supplying dealers service dept)
Then about 15 minutes later I phoned back to cancel, there was no way I was letting this shop have my pride and joy to work on. Now it's booked in at supplying dealer, at least one of the techies there is familiar with my bike and sounds like he knows a bit about Guzzis.
By the way,the one that didn't know about the oil for the information of UK riders, it's a multi franchise, plus moto Guzzi shop not too far from Wigan.

 

[jklotz]

Id they didn't even know what kind of oil to put in, I don't think I'd be going there either :lol:

 

[mark1960]

Hello Fatal. I live up the road from you in Bury. I have just part exed my Breva for a Stelvio. I know from other forums that the oil question is thrashed to death. I tracked down the 10/60 from opie oils. The engine and gearbox 85/90 and 90 was a bit of a nightmare. The Rotra 85/90 is only sold by opie in bulk. I found that Moto Corsa buy it in bulk and then put it into litre bottles.This is the only place I have found it. But after all that I have spoken to the blokes at Twiggers and at Shorrocks and they both use 15/50 . I had my Breva serviced and MOT'd at Shorrocks after recommendations from another forum I use and they were spot on. Workshop blokes were friendly and happy to chat and give advice.......even after they had took your money.
I have a good idea who the dealer is you are talking about and after digging about I have not heard anything good. Youles in Manchester said they could service my Breva but then did not sound too sure if they had an axone to set it up properly even though they are a Piaggio agent. Bit of a pain going to Shorrocks in Preston. But getting a good service is worth the trip

 

[Brian UK]

You can find an up to date list of all UK Guzzi dealers here.
http://motoguzziclub.co.uk/docs/dealer_ ... y_2010.pdf

 

[mark1960]

Robinsons in Rochdale and Millenium in St Helen's are part of the same group now after going belly up. Think they are owned by AJM or something that sounds like that.

 

[rgakrill]

Robinsons and Millenium are part of the KJM group that originated in Wrightington between Wigan and Chorley. A bunch of secondhand car dealers if you ask me!

I have just picked up my Stelvio from Shorrocks in Preston after the cams and followers were replaced due to wearing out after 6600 miles. At first they tried to get me to pay for the flushing oil and engine oil but I told them to get stuffed and complained to Piaggio who (unusually) agreed with me and said they would pay for the oils. However it took Shorrocks 12 days to get the oil (I assume they insisted on AGIP).

I had a similar experience to Fatal when I had the first service done by Shorrocks. They used Putoline 10W40 but I didn't notice for a couple of thousand miles. I picked up some 10W60 fully synthetic from AFL in Leyland and changed it myself.

Bike dealers really dont seem to care anymore!!!

Ackers

 

[mark1960]

I really wish I was more mechanically competent and I could do work myself. I hate relying on dealers to do it and hope I dont get shafted

 

[Penis Rotor]

I really can't comment on the UK but here it is not always the dealer trying to 'Shaft' anyone, although that can and does happen. Quite often it is simply incompetence. Unfortunately as a society we have become increasingly de-skilled. Many shops don't have mechanics, they have 'Technicians'. Why they have to use a different, fancy, word for somebody I don't know but it seems that nowadays if you can pull out and replace a drain plug and change filters and brake pads with the occasional chain and sprocket thrown in this is supposed to indicate that you have a detailed understanding of the hows and whys of what makes a motorbike tick. And, of course, be able to charge accordingly!

Running a business properly has a lot of overheads. It's not a licence to print money. To do the job well requires investment in not only space and tooling but training and education as well. It's those areas where many modern bike businesses fall down.

Put simply, choose carefully not only where you go but also what machine you choose. Most modern bikes are very good and need little in the way of work beyond regular servicing. If though they DO need more then it is important to have someone you can rely on who is knowledgeable enough to perform the tasks needed. This is the same be the machine a Harley, a Honda or a Guzzi. The advantage of the first two is that dealers for these brands are ten a penny so if you DO have a poor experience with one shop you can change your allegeiance to another.

With a Guzzi it can be considerably harder, although in the UK 'Distance' is a lot less of an issue than here. Many of my customers come from Sydney or further afield, 150-200 miles is not uncommon. Same for the other blokes who know their shit in Oz. Mario in Perth has people who ship their bikes down from the Pilbara for service in Perth! Surely in a postage stamp sized island like the UK riding 50 miles isn't that big an ask???

If there is nobody who can work on the bike there are essentially two choices. 1.) Learn to do it yourself and purchase the neccessary tools to do it. or 2.) Sell it and buy something else that you can get reliable service on. That doesn't seem too difficult to me??

Pete

 

[mark1960]

Wise words,and I agree with you completely. Its not particualrly skills in basic bike maintanence. I can change oil,filters,plugs,remove wheels etc,etc. Its more to do with having the confidence to furtle with things that either your life depends on or seriously dropping a bollock that will cost. Guzzi dealers are thin on the ground in the UK so switching is a problem. If the option is switching to bikes that are easier to maintain you would be restricted to Urals and Enfield Indias. I dont mind paying for good work."you get what you pay for" I can live with that. I'm not looking for getting it cheap. I want it done right. Any make bike mechanics who do the job you pay for are worth their weight in gold and word soon spreads via forums like this and they make money.
When I'm stitching people up or giving them injections they trust me to know what I am doing because they dont and I dont expect them too. "dont worry sir! arteries always gush like that! it will settle down in a few days when its bedded in" :lol:

 

[kwn306]

Pete, you make excellent points.

Here in the US, your lucky to have one Guzzi dealer per state and 9 times out of 10 they are a new and unskilled with the product. But with good general mechanical skills one can work on a Guzzi, they are pretty simple design.

What gets me is the unreliability with the electrics, specifically the coils, plug wires and plug boot.

I took your advise and purchased the new boots, I unscrewed the wires from the old boots and screwed on the new ones only to discover that the assembly is now too short to reach the plug. Had to order some wire, it was home when I got there last night. Took the bike apart, installed the new wires and the bike ran fine last night. Went to start it this morning and it would only run on one cylinder, after some quick trouble shooting I discovered the right hand coil is dead now.

So in a year of ownership the bike has had 4 sets of HT leads, 4 sets of plug boots and the left side coil replaced and now the right side coil has taken a dump. I have looked real hard on these electrical bits and I don't see the word "lucas" printed on any of them......they sure act like it though. For this reason and this reason only I find the Stelvio a very unreliable M/C.

Do you have any suggestions on how to improve these electrics? Otherwise I'm going to have to find something else. I had to dig out my old 2003 Kawasaki Concours / GTR this morning from the corner of the garage, it has a tick under 200K on the clock and it started right up and the bike hasn't been used since last November......it was on a Battery Tender though. That bike has paid for itself a 1000 times, best $6500 (new) I ever spent.

 

[WayneOrwig]

So in a year of ownership the bike has had 4 sets of HT leads, 4 sets of plug boots and the left side coil replaced and now the right side coil has taken a dump.

Is the coil primary opened . Is the secondary opened? Is the high voltage connection carbon tracked?
I don't recall anyone else having a coil fail.

 

[kwn306]

So in a year of ownership the bike has had 4 sets of HT leads, 4 sets of plug boots and the left side coil replaced and now the right side coil has taken a dump.

Is the coil primary opened . Is the secondary opened? Is the high voltage connection carbon tracked?
I don't recall anyone else having a coil fail.

Wayne,

My 1st coil was putting out too much voltage and blowing holes in the HT lead at or near the 90 deg bend just before the plug boot. I haven't checked my coil out yet so I can't answer your question, but I do know it isn't putting out anything right now, hooked up my coil tester from working on outboards and bikes in the 60's and 70's and have nothing. I will be out of town this weekend because my youngest is graduating from college, so no trouble shooting will be done over the weekend. Was hoping to take the Stelvio to a COG rally in Somerset, PA on the 20th but it doesn't look like that is going to happen.

My dealers mechanic just came back from MV Gusta school and was talking to other wrenches that also sell / service Guzzi's, he informed me that they are having the same problem as well with the Stelvio's and Griso's 8 valve motor. They don't know if its a coil issue or a heat issue and the HT leads are breaking down.

When I get more information I will let you know.

 

[kmartin]

Kurt,

I've been suspecting a weak coil for a while now. I put the NGK plug caps on last weekend and performance has improved significantly. The left wire was short, but I just had to reroute it outside of the frame rail and it reached with plenty to spare.

Is there a "easy" way to access the coils, or do I need to remove the fairing? That's whats kept me from digging in to them so far.

Hope changing your other coil gets you on good hardware from here on out.

 

[kwn306]

Kurt,

I've been suspecting a weak coil for a while now. I put the NGK plug caps on last weekend and performance has improved significantly. The left wire was short, but I just had to reroute it outside of the frame rail and it reached with plenty to spare.

Is there a "easy" way to access the coils, or do I need to remove the fairing? That's whats kept me from digging in to them so far.

Hope changing your other coil gets you on good hardware from here on out.

Faring has to be removed :angry: :angry: :angry: I made another post "Electrical Gremlins & Charcoal Canister", check out that for the rest of the story. My beast is alive and well as of Sunday at 6PM.

 

[mark1960]

I picked up my Stelvio from a Honda dealer. They had serviced it but used 10w30 semi synthetic. I went down to Robinsons this morning and got 4 lites of 10w60 synthetic and a UFI filter. Happier now

 

[kmartin]

Faring has to be removed :angry: :angry: :angry: I made another post "Electrical Gremlins & Charcoal Canister", check out that for the rest of the story. My beast is alive and well as of Sunday at 6PM.

Thanks Kurt,

I saw your other post after I put this up. I guess I knew the answer already, but was hoping you had some special trick.

Do you pull the dash then remove the screws above and outboard of the headlights and pull the whole fairing off the front?


Glad to see your problems apprear to be resolved.

 

[kwn306]

Faring has to be removed :angry: :angry: :angry: I made another post "Electrical Gremlins & Charcoal Canister", check out that for the rest of the story. My beast is alive and well as of Sunday at 6PM.

Thanks Kurt,

I saw your other post after I put this up. I guess I knew the answer already, but was hoping you had some special trick.

Do you pull the dash then remove the screws above and outboard of the headlights and pull the whole fairing off the front?


Glad to see your problems apprear to be resolved.

Keith,

Yes pull the unit as one piece, you need to remove the speedo, this is also a good time to pull the windshield and give it a good cleaning where you couldn't reach normally. Remove the two screws on each side of the faring in the front that screw into the headlight bucket, there are four total these are the bottom two. There is a screw behind the charcoal canister that needs to be removed (I think) and then all the others that you can see and get to and the faring slides forward right off, it helps to have a spare set of hands to gently spread apart the faring over the gas tank.

The trick is getting those two bottom screws back in, once that happens the rest is a piece of cake. My fat arthritic hands were giving me fits, you need a 3mm allen, I had one on a 6" 3/8 drive extention, once I finally got them started, I installed a universal and a 18" extention and ratchet and tighten them buggers up.

Good luck.

 

[kmartin]

Thanks Kurt,

I thought it was something like that, but couldn't rememmber for sure.

Keith

 

[bigtex]

The trick is getting those two bottom screws back in, once that happens the rest is a piece of cake.

Yep, those two screws deep inside the front are absolute bears for big arms and made worse with extra farkle wiring in the way. I found the hot trick last time I did this was to put a little dab of something tacky (I used Plastitak, something the art teacher wife has gobs of) to set the screws in the holes before I try to put the fairing back on. That way they are in place and only need turning with the allen wrench to tighten. I found an articulating socket head in the right size that makes things a bit easier when combined with about 3 or 4 extensions That way my hands stay out of that space, I can see what I am doing.

 

[kwn306]

The trick is getting those two bottom screws back in, once that happens the rest is a piece of cake.

I found an articulating socket head in the right size that makes things a bit easier when combined with about 3 or 4 extensions That way my hands stay out of that space, I can see what I am doing.

Being able to see what you are doing????? Since when has that been a requirement to work on a M/C