New suspension for my Norge

[abbienormal]

After my complaint about the centerstand dragging on my Norge I was told the problem is the shock. I have the newer heavier spring on mine. Now I have Ohlins on my 1987 Honda VFR and Works Performance on my 1998 Honda PC800. Looking into shocks and upgrading the forks on the Norge I have found only HyperPro acually lists fork springs and a rear shock. Ohlins, Penske, Elkins had no plans to do anything. Works Performance offered to make one for me if I gave them the dimensions and Traxxion offered to upgrade the forks if I sent them to their shop.
Is the HyperPro everything I could want? I am tempted to go Works Performance and then we would have at least 2 choices and I have past experience with them.

Any other suggestions?

Rudy

 

[abbienormal]

One other thing I forgot to include in my last post. Does the shock come out the top or the bottom? I have the shop manual and it never mentions rear shock removal. I do like how in one photo the bike has a yellow spring then the next photo it has a red spring.
I am sure I can figure it out but hearing from some one who knows will save some time.

Rudy

 

[Bill Hagan]

Rudy, was chatting with jetdoc on the phone about Norge suspensions when you were posting this. I'm visiting grandbabies in Baltimore and wondering how anyone survives winters here when I realized he was in Nebraska which can make Siberia look like Hawaii on some days. :lol:

Anyway, there's quite a bit of discussion here on the suspensions mods you can do. And, guess what, not everyone agrees.

Seriously, do a search, tho you just might start here:

https://www.guzzitech.com/index.php?op ... =43&id=707

https://www.guzzitech.com/index.php?op ... itstart=20

I have "Todd's" Hyperpro rear shock and a 1200 Sport fork swapped for stock with Todd's YSS progressive springs. I have not done an exhaustive, scientific, charts and math set-up yet, but the overall impression is an astonishing difference from stock.

As I was telling jetdoc, however, someone who is capable of exploiting their Norge can no doubt tell the difference, but I am hard-pressed to articulate measurable improvement as result of front changes. I do not for a moment doubt those, but am not skilled enough to note or discuss those.

I will say, tho, that the rear shock makes a "night-day" distinction seem faint praise. Astonishing. Must ride to believe.

Again, IMO, all of this depends very much on your "fighting weight," your SO's ditto, etc., etc. In my case, I am married to a slip of a thing, but she travels like Hannibal to Rome, with provisions for weeks. And, I am hardly svelte. I also ride beyond my abilities, but, thankfullly, well within in the upgunned Norge's forgiveness basket.

Best wishes on finding the best solution for you.

Bill

P.S. I posted here somewhere pix of the swap-out and blackcat did same, as I recall. I ordered the purple-spring version but got black. Annoyed me at first, but that was ... erm ... stupid. Whatever the color, darn thing is magnificent.

 

[guzzibob]

Racer X who runs this board sells the Hyperpro stuff, I'm sure he will post/contact you at some point. I believe he will get your specifics (weight, 1 or 2 up, riding style, etc) have shock designed for your specifics. Before we go there, to be sure, have you taken these other steps:-cut back the centerstand stop to almost nothing, makes a BIG difference; utilized the stock shock preload & damping adjustments? For me, at 170 lb, NEVER ride 2 up, that was enough at the rear, though after doing that I felt I had to go ahead & get the Hyperpro fork springs & PD cartridge valve emulators,which made a big difference up front. I also in between long trips remove the bags & raise up the exhaust while I play in the local canyons. Don't ever scrape anymore, had a lovely ride just yesterday in the canyons. If you are considerably heavier/ride two up & ride at all aggressively, pretty much a given you will need a new shock of some sort. I've heard a lot of very good comments on the Hyperpro, only 1 guy felt it was a bit too stiff for him. Maybe that was early on, Todd/Hyperpro were still figuring it out?

 

[abbienormal]

Hopefully Todd will contact me. The PD valve emulators are something new I had not heard of. The front feels vague to me but I am no expert. I have heard changing to 10wt will help but I think I may just go whole hog. I am a little heavy at 170 pounds nekkid so probably 185 or so in full kit. I cut the centerstand stop back to about rubber coated status, did not like how it looked still after scaring myself silly grinding it out prior to this so I took it off but I want it on.
I know all the theories of how the stock suspension is "good enough". I am no expert rider but if you had told me installing the Ohlins on my VFR would make that much difference I would have said BS. On my PC800 the change was so dramatic the lady friend, who knows nothing about bikes, commented on how much better it rode and cornered. She does not like getting on and off the Norge so I ride it solo for now. Still trying to get her to ride the Norge as she refuses after trying to get on and off in the garage. She has bad hips and the PC is a lot easier for her. I may try to bag a test ride on a California this summer with her on the back. I am going to sell the 1994 PC800, maybe the VFR and possibly the TS125 to free up some cash for a purchase of something else. Problem is I dislike floorboards.
I want to this once and right.

Rudy

2007 Moto Guzzi Norge
1998 Honda PC800
1994 Honda PC800 – To be reassembled
1992 Yamaha Riva Razz 50cc scooter
1987 Honda VFR700F2
1974 Suzuki TS125
1972 Suzuki TS90
2003 Honda TRX350 Rancher ATV

 

[Brian UK]

I read an article in a French language Belgian bike mag a few months ago. It was about the Norge which they owned and ran. They wanted to also improve things, and took it to a specialist, who did manage to fit an Ohlin rear unit with great success.
Unfortunately I don't have the mag now, so have no exact details.

 

[abbienormal]

I emailed Ohlins and they said they had no plans on building a shock for the Norge. I wonder if this is a case of one hand not knowing what the other is doing.


>
> Message:
> I read an article in a French language Belgian bike mag a few months ago. It was about the Norge which they owned and ran. They wanted to also improve things, and took it to a specialist, who did manage to fit an Ohlin rear unit with great success.
> Unfortunately I don't have the mag now, so have no exact details.

 

[Chuck in Indiana]

abbienormal wrote:

I emailed Ohlins and they said they had no plans on building a shock for the Norge. I wonder if this is a case of one hand not knowing what the other is doing.


>
> Message:
> I read an article in a French language Belgian bike mag a few months ago. It was about the Norge which they owned and ran. They wanted to also improve things, and took it to a specialist, who did manage to fit an Ohlin rear unit with great success.
> Unfortunately I don't have the mag now, so have no exact details.

Just mail Todd at Guzzitech. He'll fix you up.

 

[Brevabrabo]

I know my dealer has got a heavier spring for the Norge/Breva models. Especially for duo- or luggage use.
Maybe check their website www.tlm.nl (also in English) But I guess most of you will know that already...
Ciao, Dolf.

 

[Allan]

Rudolph -

I to have been in search of an alternative shock for my 1200 Sport. I did install the HyperPro fork springs and shock spring; certainly it is the least expensive route. It did improve things and I have no regrets but it is far from pefect, especially when pushing the bike hard. If you don't mind spending a bit of money you can send it all to Lindemann Engineering, www.le-suspension.com. They will re-valve and re-spring the shock. They did a V11 for me a few years ago; I was impressed.

I have seen an Ohlins on the Griso so I am hoping someone will adopt one to the Norge/Sport. As far as removing the shock I saw a post where the guy removed it from the bottom but I couldn't figure out how he did it. It's a bit of work but removing the shock from the top is straight forward..

 

[blackcat]

Allan wrote:

Rudolph -

As far as removing the shock I saw a post where the guy removed it from the bottom but I couldn't figure out how he did it. It's a bit of work but removing the shock from the top is straight forward..

I removed the shock from the bottom and it was quite easy. Took about 20 minutes or so to get it out and about 10 minutes to get the Hyperpro installed.

I talked to Jim @Pro Pilot Racing(732-928-7800) before I bought the Hyperpro springs and valveing for the front forks, and decided that I didn't want to spend the $600.00 for him to install Ohlins springs and a valveing kit. Add shipping there and back will get you to $700 bucks fairly quickly.

t

 

[guzzibob]

Blackcat, you didn't say how much of a difference you thought the Hyperpro fork springs & valves made. So? Like I said, for me it made a big difference over stock, both on the open road & in the canyons. If I wasn't planning on my Norge being primarily a long distance bike, I probably would have asked Todd to go back in & stiffen up the valve adjustment a bit. Given the planned usage, decided it was a good compromise as it was. Certainly way, way better than stock in almost every way.

Abbienormal, I'm only saying that the stock shock, properly adjusted, was good enough for me. If you feel it isn't good enough for you, then it isn't.

 

[blackcat]

guzzibob wrote:

Blackcat, you didn't say how much of a difference you thought the Hyperpro fork springs & valves made. So? Like I said, for me it made a big difference over stock, both on the open road & in the canyons. If I wasn't planning on my Norge being primarily a long distance bike, I probably would have asked Todd to go back in & stiffen up the valve adjustment a bit. Given the planned usage, decided it was a good compromise as it was. Certainly way, way better than stock in almost every way.

Abbienormal, I'm only saying that the stock shock, properly adjusted, was good enough for me. If you feel it isn't good enough for you, then it isn't.

Bob,

I am happy with the Hyperpro front and rear suspension. Way better over stock though its still not as good as the Ohlin's on my Lemans but I am near the end of my tires(Roadsmarts), so after a new set it should be just fine.

Tom

 

[GTM®]

Enjoying reading the posts here guys, thanks for the words on the HyperPro products. They are proving to be quite good.

My experience with the Breva & Norge, (I'm closing in on 200# with full gear) left me wishing for much more from the suspension. I should have my Norge Test Ride Video online again soon to back myself on this.
The stock rear shock (with the later/thicker spring) is fair, and allows preload adjustability, which is good for anyone who varies their load often... However, the HP spring kit & YSS PD valve/emulators seem to get it in the ballpark (outside of rear shock fade on warm[er] days). The 460 Mono HP shock is best bet for anyone over 170 lbs... and at $614 to your door, is one of the best deals going right now for such a nice piece.

A good suspension shop can likely get a Öhlins or other rear shock fitted for most any modern monoshock bike, but expect closer to $900~1100+, and honestly for a Breva/Norge the HyperPro is right there and a great value in comparison.

 

[abbienormal]

RacerX what I was wondering is if you do the fork kits and how much. As for the shock I assume I just order it from HP or my dealer? Speakers said he could get me the spring kit but I may want the emulators also and while I am a decent wrench on the older Hondas I have not played with these before. Feel free to contact me off list.

Rudy

 

[GTM®]

abbienormal wrote:

RacerX what I was wondering is if you do the fork kits and how much. As for the shock I assume I just order it from HP or my dealer? Speakers said he could get me the spring kit but I may want the emulators also and while I am a decent wrench on the older Hondas I have not played with these before. Feel free to contact me off list.

Hi Rudy, thanks for the post/inquiry.
I can do the PD valve install for anyone willing to stop by or ship me their forks. Kit is $195 complete per my website HERE.
I'd be happy to do the install with purchase of above kit for $250 total (including the kit) + return shipping. The install isn't too tough if you are set up for it, though the adjustment is quite a pain to re-adjust if you get it wrong.
As for the shock, I sell those too HERE -- and the Fork Spring Kits HERE.

Feel free to contact me direct for more info or to order, e-mail; Todd at GuzziTech.com (preferred) or PM.

 

[RJVB]

I know someone here in France who had his shock rebuilt at EMC (I think). He's quite happy with that too, and not to put up unfair competition to Todd, he paid a lot less than what the HP plus shipping would have cost.

I now have the latter MG shock, and 16W oil in the forks. Makes a lot of difference already, but then I only managed to scrape the centre stand twice...

As to the route to take: there's probably less fiddling if you go through the top rather then the bottom, but you'll have to disconnect the ABS and remove the battery box. My dealer's mechanic went that route, and it took him a *long* time (not nice for a warranty job...)

 

[zoom zoom]

Rudy, I also installed the Hyperpro shock and springs from Todd. I am by no means a fantastic rider, but the difference is dramatic. It was well worth the change! I never touched the rear shock from its adjustment as sent. I did end up backing the preload off two turns on the front from the recomended setting. Two thumbs up!

To get the rear shock out, twist the preload knob in as far as it will go. Then break loose the phillips head screw in the center of the handle and remove the plastic knob. You have to hold your tongue just so, but you will be able to extract the original shock out the bottom. I did the job with the bike on the centerstand. I stuck a board under the tire to keep the rear end from dropping after the shock was loose.

Zoom Zoom,
John Henry

 

[abbienormal]

I really appreciate the info on the shock removal. I know I would have fought with it for a half hour and then went "I should remove this knob!" I was planning on trying to remove it out the bottom as I not only did not want to remove the ABS unit but also the additional fuse box I had installed for my heated gear and my intercom (which is also there and has never been used).

I ordered the shock from Todd and just today I sent my forks on the way to him. I am going to get the kit installed, springs, and the new shock. It is a chunk of change but I saved the money to do it already anyway. My poor Norge is currently tied down on my lift with no front. A good time to install the new Michelin Pilot 2 tires I bought for it. I also feel the front brake has been very grabby. I checked the rotors and they have some warping so I am getting new ones under warranty and I plan on installing another brand of brake pad, maybe Ferodo, to see if some of the grabbieness (is that a word?) will leave. They grab hard sometimes and others they are fine. It may be the warping but I am doing both.

Rudy

 

[RJVB]

Just be careful when you remove the knob not to lose the little ball-bearing which allow the knob to 'click'!